Cash shop should be to buy: Cloth Map!! (please), T-shirts, hoodies, mouse pads, miniatures of in game items, maybe posters? ... junk like that.
NO NAME CHANGES or Server transfers !!! AT ANY PRICE !! Both of those allow for people to be douche bags and when they get where everyone has them on ignore or won't group with them, they change the name or move servers and start all over.
I've got no real big issues with a cosmetics and account/character management type of shop. As long as identical cosmetics can either be crafted in game or the ones in game are superior/ more varied. No to anything that adds an advantage to a character or gameplay, or allows access to in game currency.
Nephretiti said:I still say you are trying to force your will upon folks and how they like to play. Let the player make the decision as to how they play. I understand how you want to play. It is the same way I want to play. But I would rather let the masses pay for fluff. Your way of thinking is why EQ2 did so poorly vs. WoW. It is one thing to want a REAL game with some challenge but when it comes down to it - the masses pay the bills. Rather than try to make a go at it with just the real gamers (us) I would like to see an attempt to appease the masses in such a way as it has virtually no affect on us. Just give us the widget to turn that crap off.
and I say you're trying to force your will upon folks who don't want it.
where do we go from here?
Well - the difference is that MY way allows all of us to get what we want from the game in our own way.
YOUR way lets you play the way you want while at the same time prevents all those folks with loose cash from paying the DevTeam for a pair of fuzzy bunny slippers only they will see while at the same time giving the DevTeam money to "play" with while further developing the game.
@Nephretiti
I'm the kind of guy who would chose not to hide them and stew in my hatred the whole time. If people did choose to hide them it would show the characters with the items looking pretty ugly instead of looking cool with normal items. That's how it could harm me and others.
Nephretiti said:Well - the difference is that MY way allows all of us to get what we want from the game in our own way.
YOUR way lets you play the way you want while at the same time prevents all those folks with loose cash from paying the DevTeam for a pair of fuzzy bunny slippers only they will see while at the same time giving the DevTeam money to "play" with while further developing the game.
Your way doesn't allow my way. If you still have the option to buy stuff, its still in the game regardless of whether or not I can see it. You are still changing my game and offering something to someone based on external wealth, even if they are the only one that can see it.
This is literally the same argument used to justify fast travel. "If you don't want to instantly travel to a place, you have the option of walking." Its still there, and the fact that people can personally utilize it is not a good thing and has an effect on others.
For instance, if you can buy the Glamorous Winter cape in the shop but other players can craft it (or something similar) at a high skill level using rare materials, that guy who bought his for cash will be less likely to buy such an item for in-game currency. It would therefore impact others as well as the economy at large.
for pure cosmetics i have no issues with it. however, it seems to be very hard to leave it there when the cash starts pouring in and we start getting xp potions etc... i fear that less with this dev team, since i believe they believe that would end up hurting the game.
thing about cosmetics is it usually ends up being we sell 20 cosmetics and that gives us money to make more content. without the money from cosmetics, that content wouldn't exist. thus those sells fund more fun stuff for me while giving no advantage to the other player.
the only 2 ways it affects other players, that i can see, is those people are less likely to buy crafted/looted articles for cosmetic purposes, which is often a low amount of sales anyway. and we see them, so if someone were in, say a santa costume, it might hurt another persons immersion.
neither issue is huge to me, although, rudolph in vanguard actually made me hate christmas so maybe the second is kind of big to me....... :) keeping cosmetics game appropriate solves that, however
i am not a person that thinks any deviation from a game i played 20 years ago makes my life a personal hell and even got over rudolph.
i vote 6 in one hand, half dozen on the other on cosmetics.
Cash shop's imo should never increase a player's power period. They can have stuff like appeareance clothes, non-interactive pet's, name changes, server changes etc etc but never anything like weapons, armor, faster mounts, exp potions, buff food/items etc etc.
In game shop...No No No, no matter how simple, harmless, cosmetic only you make it,weeks months years later other things start to creep into the shop, first it's mounts then Xp potions then an item with a minor stat than a major stat and so on. Don't start what your can't stop.
I have seen many games go down quickly with cash shops. ONE of the biggest reasons I decided to support Pantheon was the hope that a person's gear was earned through questing, crafting or the crazy random GM spawned event. I think IF you are trying to appeal to some of us "old timers"... you will need to be good at what you do and learn to work well with others. Some will take longer for this than others.
Nephretiti said:You should not be able to determine whether or not someone plays with fluff items in-game. By voting no, all you are doing is corrupting the play of those that want the fluff items. You should be ashamed of yourselves!
I have to do far worse to be ashamed of myself I'm afraid, I feel perfectly comfortable having an opinion :D. And I don't think it corrupts other people's gameplay to not have a cash shop, it would most likely mean the fluff items'd be obtainable within game. That's the way it should be in my opinion.
Besides that, I'm somewhat of a sceptic. I don't necessarily buy that people throwing cash at a cash shop equals a much better game from a resource point of view. It screams "money grab" to me. If a $15 sub doesn't cut it for the devs, I'd rather see them mention that in a straightforward manner and discuss it from there.
Again - most of the responses to MY posts are including arguments that there should be NO cash shop because it affects gameplay. Maybe you do not understand what it means when I say that it should never EVER affect game mechanics in any way. No - there should be nothing that affects trvle speed in any way. No, there should be no potions for XP or anything else that a player can use for altering in-game stats or mechanics IN ANY WAY. There should be NOTHING that affects ANY game-play in ANY WAY - EVER.
As for the one response saying that turning off fluff items would result in armor sets that were just too ugly? That would be something to take up with the DevTeam. But the widget to "turn view of fluff items off" - would only make it so that whenever you viewed someone wearing fluff items, you would see the normal appearence items we ALL see anyways. If the item is "too ugly" well then that is the problem of the DevTeam and something we all live with anyways.
One response was a reply that the shop should never sell items that crafters create. I agree. There should be nothing in the cash shop that crafters create. I am a HUGE crafting geek. I don't want copies of stuff I make in the cash shop! Now if you are saying that there should be nothing in the cash shop that fills a SLOT that crafters can create? That's a debatable statement. On the one hand I want to agree with you in sooo many ways. If I have the option to create a fluff-piece for a cape then I can agree with you. If all the capes I make are useful items with stats etc. then no - it would be OK to put fluff-items in the cash shop.
Just seeing the title of this post makes me almost toally regret pledging to begin with.
The ONLY thing I wouldn't mind people spending money on, is character slots- and maybe bank space??
I quit playing EQ1 soon after those dumb card game things were introduced. In-game purchases RUIN the game !! I understand pledgers getting rewards, and I'm all for that, they helped get a game on the market.
Kilsin said:What are your thoughts on purchasing in-game items, where should the line be drawn in your opinion?
Disclaimer: Predetermined CM Content created by myself months ago. :)
I draw the line at NO
Nothing ruins an Online World faster than a cash shop.
You lose the awe factor when you see a higher level player with armor/items that you can strive for. Oh I can just buy a cosmetic item that looks cool.
VR will have failed if there is a need for cosmetic gear.
As I didn't played any MMO in the last decade or so, I wonder if some game put something "else" than items in sale? For instance, we could buy tickets for specifics unique events. I remember having this kind of event in EQ (GM Events) where special mobs / theme was applied to a zone. While it was free back than, I would have gladly paid to go to some of them.
Hey Guys can we please STOP ! :) We are allowing this topic to get way way out of hand. First of all, not only Brad, but Kilsin as well has stated there will be NO cash shop ! So please, please let's not allow this to drive a wedge in the community for no reason. It was a simple topic that kilsin, not Brad, was wanting to give an opportunity for discussion. I appreciate that opportunity which means they see this community as adults being able to do just that... discuss it. VR has been stating for over 2 years now, and also just recently by Brad himself that there will be no cash shop! I have to take these guys for their word, they have given no other reason to doubt there position on this topic. So please, everyone take a deep breath and regroup :) Let's focus this energy on those topics that do matter, thx guys !
# tooblessedtobestressed
Kelem
Kelem said:Hey Guys can we please STOP ! :) We are allowing this topic to get way way out of hand. First of all, not only Brad, but Kilsin as well has stated there will be NO cash shop ! So please, please let's not allow this to drive a wedge in the community for no reason. It was a simple topic that kilsin, not Brad, was wanting to give an opportunity for discussion. I appreciate that opportunity which means they see this community as adults being able to do just that... discuss it. VR has been stating for over 2 years now, and also just recently by Brad himself that there will be no cash shop! I have to take these guys for their word, they have given no other reason to doubt there position on this topic. So please, everyone take a deep breath and regroup :) Let's focus this energy on those topics that do matter, thx guys !
# tooblessedtobestressed
Kelem
Would of been better to not look for peoples views on a subject that is already decided. Right ?
Obliquity said:Kelem said:Hey Guys can we please STOP ! :) We are allowing this topic to get way way out of hand. First of all, not only Brad, but Kilsin as well has stated there will be NO cash shop ! So please, please let's not allow this to drive a wedge in the community for no reason. It was a simple topic that kilsin, not Brad, was wanting to give an opportunity for discussion. I appreciate that opportunity which means they see this community as adults being able to do just that... discuss it. VR has been stating for over 2 years now, and also just recently by Brad himself that there will be no cash shop! I have to take these guys for their word, they have given no other reason to doubt there position on this topic. So please, everyone take a deep breath and regroup :) Let's focus this energy on those topics that do matter, thx guys !
# tooblessedtobestressed
Kelem
Would of been better to not look for peoples views on a subject that is already decided. Right ?
Yes and no I can see where kilsin would have been coming from with that kind of question, would have been more of a curiousity kind of question, i think ? More like, "I know we aren't going to do a cash shop, but what would be the communities position on it, if it would have been a factor from the begiinning " how I would have asked it. Just for my own inquiry I think he felt the community was / is wise enough to understand the position that was already made and held up by Brad himself of NO CASH SHOP and be able to give answers accordingly. Scenario kind of thing, you know :)
Would think since it was decided what would the purpose be to even bring it up. Atleast the way the question was asked, could lead to people thinking they were changing their mind about it.
Unless he wanted to stir up things, afterall it is a pretty hot topic.
