Calmrain said:Sunmistress said:Nimryl said:/rantmode on
If this game turns into one of those solo orientated mmo's.... No offence to you guys but I'm done. I'll quit MMORPGS. This is my personal last hope for a group orientated mmo. If VR doesn't do it.. then I guess that's it. I'd do it myself! but unfortunately I'm no artist. +Keep in mind that we've/I've seen alot of "single player" orientated mmorpgs in the last 8 years or so and I'm absolutely sick these kind of posts. "There must be solo content to succeed."
I'm super defensive when I see posts like this and get very annoyed by them. Gamer "convience" is the biggest bane of my MMORPG life.. Needless to say I find it ironnic that people want to solo in a "online" group game... when there are other games out there that cater a HELL of alot more then a MMORPG. Please for the love of god can we please get a traditional group orientated game! why is all of this always so differcult? I'm like 1mm away from just walking away from this BS mmorpg era and tbh PC gaming as a whole. It's absolute madness.There isn't a like button so +1.
This dude gets it.
+1
Well said my friend.
+1 man i agree with you to be honest i wouldn't be bothered at all if they made is 5% solo 75% grp 20% raid just to be honest.....like you said its an ONLINE game to play with others why would you want to solo, and not get to know other people.
Solo'ing isn't the devil. I enjoyed being able to hop on my necro, druid, or wizard (or bard, enchanter, mage, beastlord, shaman, shadowknight) and kite / solo a couple hours away while busy afk'ing alot with other things going on in RL. Did I expect to be able to do the same on a Pally or Warrior? Nope. Can necros, druids, or wizards tank a named mob in a dungeon for sweet new loots? Were they ever as high on the desirability list for actually getting groups easier than tanks? Nope.
Variety is the spice of life. It doesn't bother me that all characters aren't on equal footing when solo capabilities are scrutinized, wether they have zero capability or seem to have been built for the sole purpose of soloing. The trick is to not allow solo'ers to be able to fight to or hold named-mob camp areas alone. Relegate them to the fluff on the sidelines. Save the real content and rewards for people working together to do things they couldn't do solo or duo regardless of their classes.
Riahuf22 said:Sunmistress said:If it's at all like EQ class choice will invariably affect soloability.
In Original EQ soloers even could if skilled, level faster than a group if they were willing to bet the farm and enter high risk scenarios (Chanter/Necro/Druid charming was abit... strong).
I would guess that particular aspect will depend alot on ingenuity and emergent gameplay and be a accidental. Though I hope it's not Faster overall XP rate.
When I watched the stream and saw the Gurkha mobs stomp face my initial thought was "found something to charm", not "O no I'll never be able to solo"
Now will every class be able to solo? I would guess not, but that doesn't mean there will be no soloing.
they could make him uncharmable, plus charming something that can one shot you isnt smart becuase once he loses charm your dead
Not 1 shot, but 1 round,with less then 2s delay between rounds figuring hasted, that's what the average pet could do in Howling stones back in the day.
Wasn't a problem 95% of the time.
Sunmistress said:Riahuf22 said:Sunmistress said:If it's at all like EQ class choice will invariably affect soloability.
In Original EQ soloers even could if skilled, level faster than a group if they were willing to bet the farm and enter high risk scenarios (Chanter/Necro/Druid charming was abit... strong).
I would guess that particular aspect will depend alot on ingenuity and emergent gameplay and be a accidental. Though I hope it's not Faster overall XP rate.
When I watched the stream and saw the Gurkha mobs stomp face my initial thought was "found something to charm", not "O no I'll never be able to solo"
Now will every class be able to solo? I would guess not, but that doesn't mean there will be no soloing.
they could make him uncharmable, plus charming something that can one shot you isnt smart becuase once he loses charm your dead
Not 1 shot, but 1 round,with less then 2s delay between rounds figuring hasted, that's what the average pet could do in Howling stones back in the day.
Wasn't a problem 95% of the time.
Did you see sometihng i didn't in the stream, becuase everytime the wizard even got near an enemy she died, im sure enchanters will be in the same but for the most part, in other words not a smart thing to charm and if you do i hope im not in your grp. just saying of course, simply doesn't sound smart in my book, plus in HS they did not hit that hard and you could last through quite a bit of punishment before getting owned even as an enchanter like last through id say easily 13 max hits., which by the way at least 6 rounds
If solo players are able to monopolize dungeons camps, clear areas of multiple mobs and gear up to end of game levels then sadly pantheon will be just like every other korean and grind to win MMO.
Back in early EQ, when players discovered the power of the Druid and kiting became a thing in online gaming forever, almost 30% of all players online at any time were a druid. It was ridiculous.
But then SoE nerfed the druid (somewhat) and things balanced out a little.
The anger comes from people thinking they should be able to solo dungeons and that the game will fail if they can't. Makes me wonder why they're even looking at the game(Nobody in this thread, but a few YouTube comments saying exactly that). I sincerely hope they stick to their guns and don't cave in to people who "need" solo content and modern conveniences. They would alienate a lot of us who have backed the game by going that route.
I'm ALL for emergent gameplay and people figuring out the classes. If it turns out some classes can solo a certain way...then cool. More power to them. I'm all for it. I like the game being as unrestricted as possible and letting the players figure things out
If people want to solo, they're not likely going to be doing it on mobs their own level.
I am very happy with seeing even your average mob being very tough. In the last streams, you could see some players duoing around the outskirts of the party. Maybe they were higher level, or maybe they were just very careful. Either way soloing is going to require finding mobs in the right area, of the right class, with the right disposition, as well as the right level. If that's too much for people to handle, there are a dozen other MMOs they can look to for enjoyment.
Isaya said:After watching the last 3 streams it seems that solo players will have a mountain to climb if they are to get anywhere. I know the faq states that solo will be hard but I did notice that inside the tower, dungeon and outside all the mobs were:
A almost always accompanied by adds.
b extremely tough to kill. You had a party of 6 on single mobs and Joppa was healing his butt off to keep the tank alive.
C Kilsin and the mage I believe were both one-shot killed. tough mobs?
If they are going to "fix" this in alpha or beta I hope they make it a little more soloable. I know some games make the mobs so easy that you can breeze through adds without even working. EQ 1 was not that way and I found it to be more of a balance when soloing. If you took on a mob that was same level as yourself it was more of an even fight.
I know Pantheon is being developed as a social game and they want people to get together and help each other. Same as EQ 1 was. But from what I saw solo players will have a real tough go of It.
Please give me self resses . LOL
First, let's set the record straight, I was not one-shot ever, I am too cool to be one-shot! Plus I jump over the edge if I get close to that happening ;)
Second, That was a mid to high level 20's "dungeon" you will never be able to solo dungeons, raids or any target with valuable loot. Soloing will be for normal parts of the world and whatever you can manage with class/skill etc. :)
So please don't judge solo ability on tough group content in a dungeon!
Kilsin said:First, let's set the record straight, I was not one-shot ever, I am too cool to be one-shot! Plus I jump over the edge if I get close to that happening ;)
LOL Kilsin, I cracked up when I heard that "I'm outta here".. you were literally: 
Riahuf22 said:Sunmistress said:Riahuf22 said:Sunmistress said:If it's at all like EQ class choice will invariably affect soloability.
In Original EQ soloers even could if skilled, level faster than a group if they were willing to bet the farm and enter high risk scenarios (Chanter/Necro/Druid charming was abit... strong).
I would guess that particular aspect will depend alot on ingenuity and emergent gameplay and be a accidental. Though I hope it's not Faster overall XP rate.
When I watched the stream and saw the Gurkha mobs stomp face my initial thought was "found something to charm", not "O no I'll never be able to solo"
Now will every class be able to solo? I would guess not, but that doesn't mean there will be no soloing.
they could make him uncharmable, plus charming something that can one shot you isnt smart becuase once he loses charm your dead
Not 1 shot, but 1 round,with less then 2s delay between rounds figuring hasted, that's what the average pet could do in Howling stones back in the day.
Wasn't a problem 95% of the time.
Did you see sometihng i didn't in the stream, becuase everytime the wizard even got near an enemy she died, im sure enchanters will be in the same but for the most part, in other words not a smart thing to charm and if you do i hope im not in your grp. just saying of course, simply doesn't sound smart in my book, plus in HS they did not hit that hard and you could last through quite a bit of punishment before getting owned even as an enchanter like last through id say easily 13 max hits., which by the way at least 6 rounds
Wizards are meant to fight AT Range...if you get too close, the mob can reach out and in some cases one shot you. :) I had an argument with another wizard in EQ who thought that you could just walk up to a mob and melee it down with your staff. Unfortunately wizard staffs are SLOW...hit once every 30 seconds or something like that...so nope ..that doesn't work. I try to stay out of arm's reach of mobs...root them, snare them, but don't let them hit or touch you. Caster mob...kill that thing as fast as you can if you are solo. If in a group...allow tank to gain agro..then hit mob with the boom boom, but try not to out damage the group...or again you've stolen agro and you're a dead wizzie. :P One more thing..if someone in the group is able to stun the caster mob...then it can't cast..and is easier to kill.
Cana
Kilsin said:
Second, That was a mid to high level 20's "dungeon" you will never be able to solo dungeons, raids or any target with valuable loot. Soloing will be for normal parts of the world and whatever you can manage with class/skill etc. :)
Does this mean a lvl 50 will never be able to handle low lvl group content ?
zubi said:Kilsin said:First, let's set the record straight, I was not one-shot ever, I am too cool to be one-shot! Plus I jump over the edge if I get close to that happening ;)
LOL Kilsin, I cracked up when I heard that "I'm outta here".. you were literally:
Hahaha, it was a lot of fun man, if I couldn't train anyone I can at least decide how I die on my own terms! :D
Iksar said:EnlightenedGuru said:Does this mean a lvl 50 will never be able to handle low lvl group content ?
That's probably not what he meant...but I wouldn't be opposed to only dungeons scaling level JUST enough to where you couldn't solo named on your own.
Yeah, I meant level appropriate but we will put things in place to stop max level character steam rolling low to mid level dungeons if it becomes a problem, it is easy to fix :)
>Soloing will be for normal parts of the world and whatever you can manage with class/skill etc. :)<
Exactly. All I want is the ability to solo in the open world. Not even all of it, just enough to give something rewarding to do when I can't or won't group.
None of my various comments about how solo content would be good for the game had dungeon content in mind.
>you will never be able to solo dungeons, raids or any target with valuable loot<
By valuable loot I assume you mean loot of dungeon boss quality or better. Open world play should give loot, and that loot should at least occasionally let us upgrade our gear, but dungeon loot should be better.
>The anger comes from people thinking they should be able to solo dungeons and that the game will fail if they can't. Makes me wonder why they're even looking at the game(Nobody in this thread, but a few YouTube comments saying exactly that). I sincerely hope they stick to their guns and don't cave in to people who "need" solo content <
Chamge your final words to "need solo dungeon content" or "need solo content that is just as rewarding to group content" and I agree in all respects, and I think this is your point. My point has been that the game needs solo content in some significant amount but at the risk of exaggeration, if we make this solo content dungeons we lose our player base, and if we maje it every bit as rewarding as group content we lose our soul as a game.
CanadinaXegony said:Riahuf22 said:Sunmistress said:Riahuf22 said:Sunmistress said:If it's at all like EQ class choice will invariably affect soloability.
In Original EQ soloers even could if skilled, level faster than a group if they were willing to bet the farm and enter high risk scenarios (Chanter/Necro/Druid charming was abit... strong).
I would guess that particular aspect will depend alot on ingenuity and emergent gameplay and be a accidental. Though I hope it's not Faster overall XP rate.
When I watched the stream and saw the Gurkha mobs stomp face my initial thought was "found something to charm", not "O no I'll never be able to solo"
Now will every class be able to solo? I would guess not, but that doesn't mean there will be no soloing.
they could make him uncharmable, plus charming something that can one shot you isnt smart becuase once he loses charm your dead
Not 1 shot, but 1 round,with less then 2s delay between rounds figuring hasted, that's what the average pet could do in Howling stones back in the day.
Wasn't a problem 95% of the time.
Did you see sometihng i didn't in the stream, becuase everytime the wizard even got near an enemy she died, im sure enchanters will be in the same but for the most part, in other words not a smart thing to charm and if you do i hope im not in your grp. just saying of course, simply doesn't sound smart in my book, plus in HS they did not hit that hard and you could last through quite a bit of punishment before getting owned even as an enchanter like last through id say easily 13 max hits., which by the way at least 6 rounds
Wizards are meant to fight AT Range...if you get too close, the mob can reach out and in some cases one shot you. :) I had an argument with another wizard in EQ who thought that you could just walk up to a mob and melee it down with your staff. Unfortunately wizard staffs are SLOW...hit once every 30 seconds or something like that...so nope ..that doesn't work. I try to stay out of arm's reach of mobs...root them, snare them, but don't let them hit or touch you. Caster mob...kill that thing as fast as you can if you are solo. If in a group...allow tank to gain agro..then hit mob with the boom boom, but try not to out damage the group...or again you've stolen agro and you're a dead wizzie. :P One more thing..if someone in the group is able to stun the caster mob...then it can't cast..and is easier to kill.
Cana
Cana i know they are suppose to fight at range, i've played many mmorpg's, my point was that if he charmed something at wrecked the wizard in what looked like 1 hit than that isn't smart in my honest opinion, it juts isn't. yes to no offense to Zy but i believe she was over nuking and it caused her own death, but i have no idea how the wizard is meant to be played it seems like the warrior does okay, until about 20 secs in and than loses aggro to her so it either means that one she got a big hit off the nuke and stole it or maybe a certain spell gets stronger the more she casts it i have no idea but i did saw her what looked to be casting spell over and over again. But he talking about playing an enchanter and seeing that guy in the red armor as the prefect charmed mob due to his high hp, high damage output and i can see that simply not working and almost feel like a mistake waiting to happen especially if you in the middle of the fight on another one of them when it breaks, just seems like a poor choice to do such a thing that could, eventually wipe your grp. Plus, Enchanters are your CCers so ultimately your job is to CC, you dps output is a second thought in my opinion i would much rather have an enchanter that didn't charm mobs like that and live the entire time and manage the pulls accordingly, than have one that charmed mobs like that and made it a content struggle becuase of how unrelable charm is in most games, and possible die due to charm breaking, and possibly wiping the grp.
I think most of the ones shots on stream where not really one shots, Those Red guard mobs where dual wielding so they probably hit the mage 2 times once she got aggro, also those mobs where recking the tank so a clothie should go down fast, other mobs didn't seem to one shot in the south saol open zone.
Seems a bit early to be complaining about combat related balance. Stuff like that is best discussed during testing phases in my opinion when you know more about all the character's abilities and what other classes can do as well. I am sure those numbers will be played with hundreds of times before release.