Forums » General Pantheon Discussion

Live Stream 05/02 - Feedback

    • 615 posts
    May 2, 2017 3:12 PM PDT

    I've been to the tower party too.Happy blade- dancing Kilsin on the edge.The sad moments when Zynxs died.I hope the death system is soft,just for her though <3 


    This post was edited by Fluffy at May 2, 2017 3:13 PM PDT
    • 18 posts
    May 2, 2017 3:13 PM PDT

    Loved the Stream and loving the feel of the game; old schoool EQ is exactly what I want with some updated AI features.

    • 514 posts
    May 2, 2017 3:23 PM PDT

    I hope they keep the experience penalty right where it is. Having one is good for the game but to heavy and people will break groups over risking their hard earned levels. Also having a team mate lose a level can make them useless to their team. Rather a debt they need to earn back. 

    • 268 posts
    May 2, 2017 3:28 PM PDT

    Was thinking about this a little more. The regional markets could work if travel time isn't trivialized. Make the markets continental and intercontinental travel difficult/time consuming and we may be in business. Port cities would bustle

    • 177 posts
    May 2, 2017 3:41 PM PDT

    Here are my thoughts on the stream:

    1. Thank you for being patient with those of us who have been clamoring for an EQ-esque game. This stream was the first time I saw what Kilsin has been saying about Pantheon being its own game. I can see so many of the best aspects of EQ there in the stream, but I also see a lot of innovation and expansion on the traditional MMO themes. The best part? It feels very organic and flows with the game without a lot of "systems" to keep track of.

    2. Thank you Joppa for how well you communicate and elaborate on the ideas behind Pantheon. Even without the specifics, your approach to how the game should flow and the devs team approach to what they want out of the game really calmed my fears about the controversial aspects of the game.

    3. Speaking of which, I really wish the question about AH had been either left out or pushed to later. It is by far one of the most controversial topics in the forums (massive locked thread as evidence). A quick 2-min answer at the end of the stream was really unfortunate. Especially as it left out so many details, and really doesn't convey how the system will deal with all the inherent problems of an AH. The upside of the stream, though, I saw so much that was being considered/approached in the way I wanted that I'm quite confident this will work out in the end.

     Overall, congratulations on a very successful experience. So looking forward to the next stream and evenually Alpha/Beta, and finally THE GAME!


    This post was edited by Archaen at May 2, 2017 6:56 PM PDT
    • 109 posts
    May 2, 2017 3:42 PM PDT
    As was mentioned a few times earlier in this thread. What's to stop people from only using one Auction house ? You may have a few people who try and work the market by taking items from one AH and selling higher and an unpopulated AH but ultimately I don't see this working as was also mentioned [This failed for same reasons in another game I won't mention] I'm not saying it will fail but how does VR plan to prevent the same fate? Dead content will always plague these types of games but if rather not see it as early as the first few months. I'm not a fan of AH system but if your going to do one I would just assume having it one mega AH. Though again I'm sure I don't have all the details to the mechanics in mind, so an elaboration would be great.

    Secondly I was going to comment on the Dleveling system but as joppa bas already gave some good feedback I'm satisfied for now that it still has multiple options in mind.
    • 177 posts
    May 2, 2017 3:45 PM PDT

    Joppa said:

    Loving the feedback everyone!

    As a general note, I just want to reiterate that our Death system is still under heavy consideration. We may move towards de-leveling in the near future (I'm not opposed to it). We may end up with a hybrid, where a certain amount of EXP debt is accumulated before an actual de-level. Or we may stick with a pure EXP-debt system.

    You can bank on us trying all 3 of these approaches, if not more, during Alpha and Beta testing before we make a final decision.

    So glad to hear this. I love the hybrid idea, but mostly I like the thought that these things will be given a fair shake. I will say, over the last few streams I have gained a great deal of respect for @Joppa, and really feel the game is in good hands from top to bottom.

    Kudos @Joppa!

    • 24 posts
    May 2, 2017 3:54 PM PDT

    Here my feedbacks about today stream and some stuff I would like to see in the future :

    - The zone design is awesome, open dungeons like this is very welcome and really the game has evolved alot since christmas.

    - Spliting mobs seems a bit to easy in my opinion, I think some tweeks could be done in this area. Npcs seems to forget their ennemies pretty quickly after one FD. What about some sneak pulling also ? 

    - There aren't enough roamers from what I see so far and not only in this zone, I know some npcs in EQ patrol for over 20 mins before returning to a same spot. I wish to see more of that.

    - Animations and spells effects look great for a start, most animation are pretty static, I would love to see some charge with shield bash or some kind of Mortal Combat "Come over here" abilities, chain with a grabbling hook as an exemple.

    - I know you guys been talking about npcs abilities coming in the future, It would be nice to see mobs running around a bit more. Some trying to flank or charge the back line etc. Tanks need to work to keep their aggro.

    - The whole auction house thing, I would prefer a bazaar more then an auction house.. it's too easy to browse an auction house, figure who sell cheap even if it's regional, the objective is to sell items offline but without driving the economy down. 

    - Rezing abilities on many classes, I feel its going to make healing classes too blend, what about adding some kind of priest npc instead at entrance of dungeons or some specific areas, that if you drag your friends bodies around him. for a fee you can have him rez your friends ? Making the cleric experience more unique.

    I'm really excited about Pantheon and plan to give you guys some professionals feedbacks when testing the game. I really want this game to succeed.

     

     

    • 333 posts
    May 2, 2017 3:56 PM PDT

    Great job guys! All the hard work you've put in has really paid off. Cannot wait to start playing!

    • 516 posts
    May 2, 2017 4:15 PM PDT

    Speaking as an EQ Chanter all I can say regarding the one-shotted wizzie is YES - you are doing this right.  Mages are glass cannons.  We are not MEANT to take a hit like that from those particular mobs.  Those guys were hitting like trucks against the tank - why would a mage take a hit and not fall over?  I was often a soloing chanter in EQ.  I would fight mobs that really could one shot me.  I learned how to not get shotted.  There are pros and cons to wearing armor and the biggest comparison is that with great power comes very little armor.

    You guys made a really great tool for EQ2 that I thought was awesome - the agro meter.  I don't know if anyone else used it but I used it on all of my characters - about 23 of them.  I also instilled the importance of them on my sons who grew up on your games.  Today they are adult college students...

    • 1949 posts
    May 2, 2017 5:48 PM PDT

    I laughed when you guys decided to try jumping off the ledge- sandbox!

    I liked how you all had to quiet down when fighting a mob because the game demanded your attention- and I especially liked the need to keep moving to get to a destination and the urgency of determining a strategy to not only deal with the mobs but also the respawn- in this crawl.

    I also liked the half-evil dwarven group on the second floor- in their camp.

    At first when Cohh looked quickly past the bevelled glass on the gnome floor, I thought it was a glitch in the graphics not being finished yet on that side and he was being polite- until I really saw the bevelled glass- that is very impressive.

    The sheer scale- at that height one cannot see too much definition into the distance and the way down was dizzying.

    Also you had the quarternity but it wasnt a "standard" quarternity as it was made up of hybrids, except for the rogue and monk.

    This may not have been intentional but this is how I read into the group make up: Everyone had their roles and Aradune was the extra, or the "12th man" like in football. Aradune sort of represented any one of us player characters in that group which I think is kind of endearing in light of his vision.

    At the end when you all were done with the major fights and "cooled down" by talking and answeing questions- generally fooling around and releasing tension in a social manner, with kilsin blinding everyone with smoke and jumping off a short ledge, I think that is exemplary of the social aspect of ending groups. It was satisfying to see - if there was a pool I would have gone fishing, just for a little to med up and then think of what do next.

    I also prefered the first person view and the new dog model looked great and really seemed to be in close quarters nipping at the mob's. 

    The scenery is gorgeous and lots of room.

    *edit: took out unecessary quotation marks*


    This post was edited by Manouk at May 2, 2017 5:53 PM PDT
    • 1915 posts
    May 2, 2017 5:57 PM PDT

    The most important part of the stream: I saw a dwarf with a huge Mohawk!

    • 514 posts
    May 2, 2017 6:54 PM PDT

    Beefcake said:

    The most important part of the stream: I saw a dwarf with a huge Mohawk!

    Rock on Beefcake =-)

    • 29 posts
    May 2, 2017 7:19 PM PDT

    The tower is sooo (too?) tall. How was it built (thousands of potential laborers)? What about all of the "floors" below the zone-in area? I could see it levitating above some pylon to gain its height. It is a mage's tower!

    Aside from that rant; It is a very cool dungeon. I do like the view and risk of falling. The cohesion of mob design, lore and zone-theme is very well done.

    The statement about regional AHs made me a bit sad, but it is a decent compromise. I'd rather there be none. My concern is the same as mentioned before, with one city becoming dominant anyway.

    I would like to second the statement about seeing hands, at least, in first person.

    Everything else is looking amazing! The progress made within the last 6 months is staggering and I am excited as ever. Please don't get the wrong impression about my gripes. I look forward to helping with testing and upgrading my pledge soon.

    • 1915 posts
    May 2, 2017 7:22 PM PDT

    It's magic!

    • 109 posts
    May 2, 2017 7:25 PM PDT

    Kilaen said:

    The tower is sooo (too?) tall. How was it built (thousands of potential laborers)? What about all of the "floors" below the zone-in area? I could see it levitating above some pylon to gain its height. It is a mage's tower!

    Aside from that rant; It is a very cool dungeon. I do like the view and risk of falling. The cohesion of mob design, lore and zone-theme is very well done.

    The statement about regional AHs made me a bit sad, but it is a decent compromise. I'd rather there be none. My concern is the same as mentioned before, with one city becoming dominant anyway.

    I would like to second the statement about seeing hands, at least, in first person.

    Everything else is looking amazing! The progress made within the last 6 months is staggering and I am excited as ever. Please don't get the wrong impression about my gripes. I look forward to helping with testing and upgrading my pledge soon.

     

    Yes you and beefcake I think answered your first question. It's a mages tower. Magic built it  I was curious about floors in between aswell and was going to ask then I just figured as above, it's a mages tower. Mages don't need stairs they have magic haha

    • 5 posts
    May 2, 2017 8:33 PM PDT

    Will there be visual queues on the mobs we are fighting or something that will draw/keep our eye on the combat rather than having to look down on our hotbar to see what to cast?

    • 9 posts
    May 2, 2017 8:42 PM PDT

    This is turning out to be fantastic! I'm a beta 3 EQ player and I even ran a guild in Vanguard. I believe this is going to be the best yet. From this stream I love how the spell graphics are taking shape! Way to go guys. I just upped my pledge to advistor; can't wait until alpha!

     

     

    • 1290 posts
    May 2, 2017 9:07 PM PDT

    Stream was fantastic. Great job! Very happy with what I saw and heard.

    • 109 posts
    May 2, 2017 9:55 PM PDT

    I just want to thank Joppa and everyone who really owned topics, questions, and areas of confusion after the first stream.

    Joppa (and others) answered a LOT of questions. Gave a LOT of information to clarify many areas of confusion. 

    Thanks guys. Fantastic job. Excellent set of streams. Special thanks for doing 2 in a row like that. So amazing. 

    I have some questions on a few things, but I will look for breakout topics since my questions a bit all over the place. 


    This post was edited by Naim at May 2, 2017 9:58 PM PDT
    • 1455 posts
    May 2, 2017 10:39 PM PDT

    Relieved to hear information about no direct item scaling and doing it via character level/skill level. It's incredibly important to me that Pantheon remain as free of artificial restrictions as possible.

    Then there is the issue with death resulting in respawn at bind. Was convinced that a bad decision was mad to allow characters to respawn in the zone they do after seeing these nexus everywhere. Hear that the current plan is back to bind without our gear put my mind at ease.

    Now if only we hear that level loss is back in and auction houses come with a heavy tax to promote traditional trade, that'd be a perfect end to this round of streaming.


    This post was edited by Dullahan at May 2, 2017 10:40 PM PDT
    • 118 posts
    May 3, 2017 3:59 AM PDT

    Great job and many thanks for this stream :)

    First of all, fights are exactly what I like and what I miss since so many years : tactical, understandable, not messy. In my mind it is the beating heart of the game and I like how it beats :).

    Environments are gorgeous and the design of mobs is sobre and strong, they is a coherence in the artistic design and nothing is exagerated or too flashy : I like it.

    About regional auction houses, that does not bothers me. To get simple, global or regional auction houses, bazaar or something else, I don't mind, I do not consider this choice as being an important one regarding how I usually play.

    I like the no deleveling choice, I got so many memories of groups broken by lost levels.

    The only choice I don't like is the fact there will be a /loc ingame, but I already talked about it in another thread and it's not useful to import discussion here.

    I think the wizard's oneshot is a bit exagerated, I would prefer Two shots. Intelligence and skill is also being able to react after a mistake, and I consider a oneshot is a missed occasion to show skill and get epic rescue.

    I like many classes getting rez abilities, it's better for group cohesion. Though I'd like there is no difference between the different rezzes in term of xp gain, cause still have in mind the fact that in EQ nearly everyone was refusing something other that cleric rez. An idea to make a difference could be adding a temporary remanence that could be specific to the class that made the rez. Could be an effect that would make the buffs cast on the rezzed guy a little bit less efficient during 1 hour, hp buffs for cleric rez, resists buffs for druid rez, speed buffs for shaman rez, etc ...

     

    • 3221 posts
    May 3, 2017 4:36 AM PDT

    I can see why pre-alpha didn't start as early as some people had hoped - instead of that being because VR didn't have enough resources to keep moving it is for the opposite reason. They had enough resources to move so significantly that testing earlier would have been ....sub-optimal.

    The two specific game design features mentioned most often in this thread are regional auction houses and no loss of levels. Not shocking, given that these have been hot topics here and VR threw in fairly specific and definitive information about current intentions. The former, my view is in the large majority - it wouldn't have been my first choice but it sounds fine to me given the wide range of opinions on the issue. The latter I don't much care about I care more about the size of the penalty but I think it is the right decision for the game. People view deleveling as overly harsh although going from level 11.01 to 10.99 is a lot better than going from 11.50 to 11.25 so this isn't necessary a rational view as much as an emotional one.

    • 77 posts
    May 3, 2017 5:14 AM PDT

    Quick question about the buff scaling that was discussed at the start. A shaman's strength buff was used as an example of something that would give full value of strength to the lower level recipient but that character would likely not be able to hit for the maximum with it because of how weapon skills worked. I was wondering how this would apply to other buffs, would a level 1 character recieve the full amount of AC/HP from the level 40 cleric's buff or would high level mana regeneration buff give the full value to a lower level character, or is there some sort of skill that would prevent that?

    • 177 posts
    May 3, 2017 6:40 AM PDT

    dorotea said:

    I can see why pre-alpha didn't start as early as some people had hoped - instead of that being because VR didn't have enough resources to keep moving it is for the opposite reason. They had enough resources to move so significantly that testing earlier would have been ....sub-optimal.

    The two specific game design features mentioned most often in this thread are regional auction houses and no loss of levels. Not shocking, given that these have been hot topics here and VR threw in fairly specific and definitive information about current intentions. The former, my view is in the large majority - it wouldn't have been my first choice but it sounds fine to me given the wide range of opinions on the issue. The latter I don't much care about I care more about the size of the penalty but I think it is the right decision for the game. People view deleveling as overly harsh although going from level 11.01 to 10.99 is a lot better than going from 11.50 to 11.25 so this isn't necessary a rational view as much as an emotional one.

    The info on both of these topics was anything but definitive (even in there direction).

    Auction House - Like I mentioned before, they should have passed on this question. The answer given by Brad is the same answer that's been out there for some time now. Because this topic is so controversial, I hoped they'd wait and put out details on how the system they chose would solve the issues it brings. This answer in the stream was completely underwhelming.

    Death Penalty - Joppa has said in this thread the "de-leveling" is still under consideration and it's not a given that it won't be in the game. Brad is the one who said there wouldn't be de-leveling, but tbf he also said the death penalty won't really be decided til well into beta. I hope they take the same approach to the AH.


    This post was edited by Archaen at May 3, 2017 6:44 AM PDT