Forums » General Pantheon Discussion

Live Stream 05/02 - Feedback

    • 164 posts
    May 2, 2017 12:57 PM PDT

    Congratulations VR for another awesome stream. This may well have been the best one so far for me, for the way the devs picked up and responded to a lot of feedback from the last one, as well as for the location and mechanics shown.

    Regarding the feedback, I was excited to hear that there are plans to make combat more intricate. In fact, I think some of what we saw today already contributes to keeping players more on their toes, namely the random targeting of players by some enemy NPCs.

    I absolutely loved the setting of the Tower of the Reckless Magician. The tight walkways and rooms seem to make pulling and fighting much more challenging - and interesting. If I may be a bit nitpicky, I hope the lighting and textures will see some improvement, as some of the walls/floors looked a little flat, but that is probably already the case since it's still early in development. Another minor issue is that the level of detail on the scenery you saw out the windows looked a bit low, with nearer and farther hills looking the same, but again I trust this will change. A final issue was that sometimes the camera would go through the scenery and other players (I got a glimpse of the back of Aradune's eyes IIRC as seen from inside the skull), so I wonder if there will be some kind of camera collision detection to prevent this.

    I think this stream really started to show off the diversity of combat, with enemies sporting widely different abilities and tactics. One thing that would make me very happy though is if players could evade ranged/magic attacks by breaking line of sight before the enemy finishes getting out the attack. Other than that, it was pretty close to perfect.

    One issue I picked up from the last round of questions and which made me curious was the reference to regional auction houses. The auction house vs. individual traders discussion is a classic and I don't want to go over it in detail. I just wanted to say that regional auction houses look like a great compromise starting point to make items discoverable as well as prevent excessive market manipulation. But it probably won't be enough to prevent it entirely, so I wonder: is VR's vision one where the market goes where players lead it, or is there going to be some degree of control? For full disclosure, I understand that "playing the market" is a big part of the game for some, but I feel when a few people start cornering the market on essential, especially low-level items, they can make the game very frustrating for more casual players by causing very steep inflation that such players cannot keep up with.

    Final question: can we have an estimate of when we'll be seeing the next live stream? :)

    • 5 posts
    May 2, 2017 1:00 PM PDT

    Yeah I was curious about the regional auction houses too. I can't wait to see how it works out.. Also im glad you can't delevel xD 

    • 514 posts
    May 2, 2017 1:10 PM PDT

    Love the stream. Very excited for region based Auction Houses. This is great to get people traveling around the world and making unique economies. Very excited. Brad we need a Bard pls =-) 

    • 487 posts
    May 2, 2017 1:12 PM PDT

    ijester said:

    Yeah I was curious about the regional auction houses too. I can't wait to see how it works out.. Also im glad you can't delevel xD 

    I almost danced when they said this. These are two things that I really wanted.

    • 1535 posts
    May 2, 2017 1:14 PM PDT

    ijester said:

    Yeah I was curious about the regional auction houses too. I can't wait to see how it works out.. Also im glad you can't delevel xD 

    Yeah this got me excited as well. I like the idea that players will meet up in certain parts of the world to trade but I also like the semi-ease of use of the an auction house. So you get the benefits of local trade as well as the benefits of an auction house without the downsides of a global auction house. Seems like a reasonable way to do things and the approach they are taking is one I agree with.

    I was always a bit concerned by those people who wanted an East Commandlands style system simply because I wouldnt' have the time to play and sell. You have to spend hours trying to sell your gear in East Commonlands and that just takes away time from the time you can actually spend playing the game.

    • 700 posts
    May 2, 2017 1:16 PM PDT

    Great stream! Fun to watch the chaos xD
    The red npc's looked awesome and the wolf pet looked and moved so much better!

    -sorte.

    • 77 posts
    May 2, 2017 1:17 PM PDT

    One thing that I was curious about that perhaps I just misunderstood is when I heard Joppa talking about buffs and having a cleric buff for the group despite being a shaman class, I thought he mentioned that if he was not using the clerics AC/HP buff he would INSTEAD use the shamans str/sta/ac buff. I was wondering if this meant that their buffs would not stack together, or if perhaps the AC portion of the buff would not stack with the AC portion of the clerics buff?

    I would assume that the str/sta would stack with at least some part of the clerics buff, just looking for a clarification on the current intent of that if possible.


    This post was edited by torveld at May 2, 2017 1:19 PM PDT
    • 82 posts
    May 2, 2017 1:21 PM PDT

    Another great session! Super excited to get my chance to join you guys in the Alpha when it becomes available.

    • 150 posts
    May 2, 2017 1:29 PM PDT

    The Regional Auction House is worrisome to me. My fear is that one city's auction house will come to be the most popular and dominate all the others into non-existance....thus leaving the playerbase with one auction house that can be gamed and manipulated.

    It all depends on access and foot traffic. Freeport was the main crossroads in EQ, and there were both druid and wizard port hubs in close proximity. This access led to the EC Tunnel bazaar. If the same factors unite to create a central gathering hub in Pantheon, then that is the only Auction House that will have an impact. And your many regional Auction Houses will be reduced to the one Central Auction House.

     

    • 161 posts
    May 2, 2017 1:34 PM PDT

    Homercles said:

    The Regional Auction House is worrisome to me. My fear is that one city's auction house will come to be the most popular and dominate all the others into non-existance....thus leaving the playerbase with one auction house that can be gamed and manipulated.

    It all depends on access and foot traffic. Freeport was the main crossroads in EQ, and there were both druid and wizard port hubs in close proximity. This access led to the EC Tunnel bazaar. If the same factors unite to create a central gathering hub in Pantheon, then that is the only Auction House that will have an impact. And your many regional Auction Houses will be reduced to the one Central Auction House.

     

    This is exactly why global auction houses were added to WoW (they were city specific originally and the main city per faction, Orgrimmar/Stormwind, was always the better auctionhouse) , its also why they added shared bank tabs to EQ

     

    • 30 posts
    May 2, 2017 1:36 PM PDT

    I think Visionary Realms have done a great job so far.

    There was some minor things....

    1. The wolf looked much better this time around. However I think it could be little thicker. Also when it attacked it could also be little closer to mobs (it felt it was standing like 2-3 meters from the mob it attacked in the circle room with balcony).

    2. It also felt mobs spawned little to fast.

    3. One hit kill on the wizard. It feels no class should go down that fast. Maybe wizard by nature could be more resistance against nukes when they are so weak (health) in general and be able to take 2-3 hits before they go down.

    4. In first person view it would be nice to see the hands, feets, weapons and spell effects when you attack.

     


    This post was edited by Elmberry at May 2, 2017 1:43 PM PDT
    • 268 posts
    May 2, 2017 1:46 PM PDT

    The issue with regional auction houses is everybody deciding to go to one area to sell. Might as well make it global. I was slightly disappointed to hear this, as I was hoping for an EC type system. Selling that way gave me something to do while just hanging out. But oh well. I'll make it work.

     

    Cool stream, even though twitch made me watch in 480p. Can't wait for it to be uploaded so I can watch again! I really liked the lore of the area, including the gnomes. The Magician sounds interesting to me

    • 79 posts
    May 2, 2017 1:47 PM PDT

    ijester said:

    Yeah I was curious about the regional auction houses too. I can't wait to see how it works out.. Also im glad you can't delevel xD 

    no deleveling worries me to be honest. back in eq1 and other games like this there needed to be a reason for people to go and farm stuff at max level if there is no deleveling what is stopping everyone at max level only logging on for raids.

     

    i really dont want that to happen i like having to farm exp between raids it keeps people connected i do understand that it can be a problem on time but most high level rezes give most exp back in games like this.

    now this problem can be solved with AAs but it is somthing i want to be thought about in advance really


    This post was edited by Akailo at May 2, 2017 1:48 PM PDT
    • 495 posts
    May 2, 2017 1:49 PM PDT

    Just a thought on the Regional auction houses (I like it, nice compromise), if by region they mean major city, them some really cool and interesting things might happen with trading.

    Because of factions and KOS Evil and Good players might find different values in different HA, and they won't be able to access them because of their faction, so player trading between good and evil races is encouraged (especially if one of the parties wants to make extra proffit). Also transporting good from one end of the world to another might be quite profitable (if portals are expensive).

    • 514 posts
    May 2, 2017 1:52 PM PDT

    Homercles said:

    The Regional Auction House is worrisome to me. My fear is that one city's auction house will come to be the most popular and dominate all the others into non-existance....thus leaving the playerbase with one auction house that can be gamed and manipulated.

    It all depends on access and foot traffic. Freeport was the main crossroads in EQ, and there were both druid and wizard port hubs in close proximity. This access led to the EC Tunnel bazaar. If the same factors unite to create a central gathering hub in Pantheon, then that is the only Auction House that will have an impact. And your many regional Auction Houses will be reduced to the one Central Auction House.

     

     

    The devs seem to be very smart, I trust they will balancing things as they intend. 

    • 495 posts
    May 2, 2017 1:53 PM PDT

    @Akailo

    I don't mid that develeling is gone, but like you I worry that this might encourage players to not care about dying, implementing some form of penalty(reduced stats) if your XP debt is big, this will deffinitly encourage dying less, and farming XP outside of leveling purposes.

    • 164 posts
    May 2, 2017 2:09 PM PDT

    Elmberry said:.

    In first person view it would be nice to see the hands, feets, weapons and spell effects when you attack.

    I meant to say this as well, but it slipped my mind when writing my post. 100% agreed.

    Nanfoodle said:

    Homercles said:

    The Regional Auction House is worrisome to me. My fear is that one city's auction house will come to be the most popular and dominate all the others into non-existance....thus leaving the playerbase with one auction house that can be gamed and manipulated.

    It all depends on access and foot traffic. Freeport was the main crossroads in EQ, and there were both druid and wizard port hubs in close proximity. This access led to the EC Tunnel bazaar. If the same factors unite to create a central gathering hub in Pantheon, then that is the only Auction House that will have an impact. And your many regional Auction Houses will be reduced to the one Central Auction House.

    The devs seem to be very smart, I trust they will balancing things as they intend. 

    You'd be surprised what motivated players can come up with :) Which is why I said regional AHs would be a good compromise starting point. For instance, a guild might have players spread across zones acting in concert to play the markets. Personally I think there should be a long-ish cooldown between buying an item in an AH and reselling them to prevent flipping, but I'm keeping an open mind.

    • 495 posts
    May 2, 2017 2:16 PM PDT

    @daemonios

    I like the idea of not getting the item you buy at the action house right away, maybe you have to wait 2-3 hours for the item to prass through inspection, only then can you pick it up. This also encourages player to player trading.

    • 208 posts
    May 2, 2017 2:34 PM PDT

    Loving the feedback everyone!

    As a general note, I just want to reiterate that our Death system is still under heavy consideration. We may move towards de-leveling in the near future (I'm not opposed to it). We may end up with a hybrid, where a certain amount of EXP debt is accumulated before an actual de-level. Or we may stick with a pure EXP-debt system.

    You can bank on us trying all 3 of these approaches, if not more, during Alpha and Beta testing before we make a final decision.

    • 79 posts
    May 2, 2017 2:35 PM PDT

    Joppa said:

    Loving the feedback everyone!

    As a general note, I just want to reiterate that our Death system is still under heavy consideration. We may move towards de-leveling in the near future (I'm not opposed to it). We may end up with a hybrid, where a certain amount of EXP debt is accumulated before an actual de-level. Or we may stick with a pure EXP-debt system.

    You can bank on us trying all 3 of these approaches, if not more, during Alpha and Beta testing before we make a final decision.

    im really glad to hear that joppa, nice to know that you will let us get our hands dirty before a final choice. also love the shaman and cleric but give us some druid love in the future too yeah =)

    • 852 posts
    May 2, 2017 2:47 PM PDT

    Joppa said:

    Loving the feedback everyone!

    As a general note, I just want to reiterate that our Death system is still under heavy consideration. We may move towards de-leveling in the near future (I'm not opposed to it). We may end up with a hybrid, where a certain amount of EXP debt is accumulated before an actual de-level. Or we may stick with a pure EXP-debt system.

    You can bank on us trying all 3 of these approaches, if not more, during Alpha and Beta testing before we make a final decision.

    For those that actually played EQ 1 and saw players de-level dozens of levels (usually becasue they were stupid and bound somewhere near aggro), de-leveling can be scary.

    Maybe de-leveling can get progressive slower, or exponentially slower, with a max of 5 levels or something.


    This post was edited by zewtastic at May 2, 2017 2:48 PM PDT
    • 1202 posts
    May 2, 2017 2:50 PM PDT

    Elmberry said:

     

    3. One hit kill on the wizard. It feels no class should go down that fast. Maybe wizard by nature could be more resistance against nukes when they are so weak (health) in general and be able to take 2-3 hits before they go down.

     

     

    I was thinking the exact same thing. Fighters get to wear armor and have melee defensive abilities to prevent melee dmg, casters should get some sort of innate spell resist or mitigation skill against magic due to that being there domain.

     

    Or even a defensive mental state that when using it decreases cast time but reduces damage taken by spells for a duration.

    More options to just giving a self only buff that gives spell resists i think. Allows for more involved combat from spell caster point of view.

    I put a post to continue the conversation on this.

    https://www.pantheonmmo.com/content/forums/topic/5396/defensive-abilities/view/post_id/110182

     


    This post was edited by Aich at May 2, 2017 3:14 PM PDT
    • 495 posts
    May 2, 2017 2:53 PM PDT

    @Joppa

    Love the Dev/community interaction/feedback.

    Keep up the good work, I wanna start wiping as soon as possible :)

    • 852 posts
    May 2, 2017 3:05 PM PDT

    Regarding de-centralized auction houses, regional aution houses (ala Vanguard).

    Oviously introduces a time-sink with travelling to remote aution houses to check prices. but there is also guild chat and other forms of communition to have others check prices.

    Creates variable pricing with no way of defining a quick global price. No central market to instantly see what items are selling for to the economy is locked down.

    Helps with immersion.

    Spreads out the playerbase.

     

    Organic aution house is fun and has some unique advantages, but it does not spread out the playerbase and is a burden for travelling from far distances thus impacting certain players more than others.

    Idea: I have seen this before, but maybe set item placed on an aution house to where if they do not sell or you remove them by 7 days, then they are eaten by the auction house for some small amount of gold. This makes players be more on top of their selling habits. :)

     

    • 126 posts
    May 2, 2017 3:05 PM PDT

    daemonios said:One issue I picked up from the last round of questions and which made me curious was the reference to regional auction houses. The auction house vs. individual traders discussion is a classic and I don't want to go over it in detail. I just wanted to say that regional auction houses look like a great compromise starting point

    to me it sounds as if they're trying to please everyone. i've had a similar feeling in the "no instances vs sharding" or "no quest hub vs popup quests" threads. but that doesn't fit to VRs vision. so i just hope they'll get it right =)