Speaking of halflings possibly getting a trap disarming ability, will there be racial abilities? And if so, will they be related to combat or non-combat abilities, or both? Example, non-combat: disarming a trap, combat: increases critical chance for a short period of time.
Wigg said:Speaking of halflings possibly getting a trap disarming ability, will there be racial abilities? And if so, will they be related to combat or non-combat abilities, or both? Example, non-combat: disarming a trap, combat: increases critical chance for a short period of time.
I always wanted to bring up a topic about racial abilities, just like how VG and EQ2 did. But will start a topic when the new forums comes up.
I’m a big fan of Locks, Traps and Similar Mechanics; I fully expect them to be included in Pantheon such as the recent video demonstrated with the locked door to the room with the Wraiths. It was nice that the key was part of the perception system allowing any class to find the key and use it, but for doors/locks that don’t have a key lying about non-lock-picking classes should at least have the ability to forge keys if plans can be found for them. As an example, if my group and I come across a locked door and can’t find a key lying about (because there isn’t one) and we don’t have a Rogue or Bard to pick the lock, then I would like if there could be an option for us to find plans on how to make a key and utilize it for locked doors in only the dungeons the plans were found for. Don’t forget to give us key-rings…
Rint
Kilsin said:Sarim said:I hope to see a good amount of traps and locks in dangerous places like dungeons. Locks should be open-able by different means: Rogues could use pick lock skill, some casters could have a (reagent using) unlock spell. Maybe fighters could just open some closed doors/chests through brute force? What I mean is, not everyone should be able to open a lock, but there must be enough classes capable of doing this, so that groups can progress through a dungeon even if they don't have the "optimal" class for doing this.
Traps in dungeons should definitely exist: false floors, pikes or darts coming out of the walls if you step in the wrong place, or mobs spawning if you ring an innocent looking bell... :)
Trapped chests are also nice (especially mobs mimicking chests :) Don't make it so that every chest is trapped however...that takes the surprise out of it. Also, traps in lower level dungeons should IMO not be fatal however (for example a trap floor which lets you fall to your death). Those are the places where you (hopefully) learn to recognize/evade traps.
Yeah, options and multiple ways to open/disarm are needed so a group/raid doesn;t get stuck and require one class, blocking progression along the way. It does add depth to the classes that can do it though and I like your traps example, possibly multiple paths and a trap or lock could lead to a short cut or bonus loot room etc. so it is not necessary but a nice bonus if you can access it :)
I second that motion ! :) I am all for it.
Traps/Locks should be introduced if at all possible - but cleverly where possible.
1. Have Traps and Locks have a difficulty rating (ie not all same) for both detection and removal. This rating is compared to the 'skill' of the person dealing with it. Some traps will be 'obvious' (Rating = V.Easy = 25) while others would be all but impossible to spot (Rating = V.Hard = 225). Player 'Ranks' in the skill + stat-bonus is compared to the Trap/Lock to determikne succes (plus some RNG element).
2. Anyone can learn/practice the skills, but are limited by race/class as to how many ranks/level (Ranks per level). This might be 5/level for Rogue/Thief, 4/Level for Assassin or (any) halfling and 2/level for 'anyone else'. This means that any character can be 'ok' at it.... but will never be a master unless trained for it (class) or bred for it (sneaky damn hobbitses).
3. Locked Doors in a dungeon should not stop all progress in that dungeon (but may close off a wing, or merely a shortcut). Most locked doors should have a 'key owner'. This may be a mob, or a container within a specific location. Locked doors should be 'breakable' in most cases (as an alternative to unlocking) but this would be lengthy and NOISY. It should stay 'broken open' until fixed by the local denizens.
4. Locked chests/boxes should also have a 'key owner' if they are indigenous, but may not (if owner away, for eg). Unless the chest is bolted down, you should be able to loot the 'Locked chest'. This will, however be heavy. So if you don't have a rogue/thief, bring somebody able to carry lots (or a donkey). As a previous poster says - now find yourself a PC to open it.... if you can trust them!
5. Spells to do these things should just confer this ability on the caster for a brief period. The level of the ability wouold depend on the casters level and skill at that type of magic. it should not be 100%.
6. There is no reason why 2 of the 12 door within a specific dungeon should not be locked at any given time. Better still - have them stay open (once unlocked by a PC) for a set period of time. After that, they will be locked again by the mobs in the dungeon. Thus, a rarely travelled dungeon is likely to have 10 out of 12 doors locked and 6 out of 12 traps reset. Beware.
TLDR: try to include them, but make them dynamic (changing) and challenging (skill vs complexity).
Kilsin said:How important do you think it is that an MMORPG like Pantheon include mechanics like this? :)
Locks are OK, provided there is more than one way to open said lock. Needing a Rogue every %&#% time because they are the only ones who can deal with locks is, frankly, poor design. Traps are fun...the first time. Then they never ever a bother or worry again because you now know exactly where that trap is located. Only if traps can truly be procedural, appearing any location where it could make sense for the environment, would traps then be something to always be on your mind.
Vandraad said:Only if traps can truly be procedural, appearing any location where it could make sense for the environment, would traps then be something to always be on your mind.
I completely agree!! Traps need to be random and procedural with unpredictable results.
As an example, if you're a player sneaking around a Dungeon trying to explore its hidden depths and suddenly you spring a trap, but instead of killing you the trap casts a curse on you that changes you into a NPC of the dungeon and makes you fully attackable. I can just imagine a rogue springing this trap by accident and not realizing he has been transformed starts to head back to his camp where his group is awaiting him, but is immediately attacked because the players think he is a mob.
The point is that Traps once discovered are rarely a threat to anyone once the word gets out on the exact location and type of trap, but by making the traps random and the location variable around the dungeon with the results of the traps being different each time they are activated will make this an interesting and fun mechanic.
Rint
I think there should be few enough that they remain special.
If there are not too many, then they can have a bit of attention spent on them to make them "entertaining" in various ways without breaking the bank.
Kilsin said:How important do you think it is that an MMORPG like Pantheon include mechanics like this? :)
Randomly generated traps every spawn cycle.
Traps that can crush you, poison you, put you to sleep, break your invis, electricity tou, summon adds to investigate.
And bear traps... rusty bear traps.
On the other hand, I want rogues to be able to lay similar traps to terrorize their enemies.
Importance level: 8 I'd say!
As others have said, yes please but they need to be dynamic and changing so as to retain the mystery and excitment. They also need to be able to be dealt with one way or another regardless of your group make up so you don't hit a dead end half way through a dungeon.
No-one with the skills / magic / strength to break the lock on the door? Better go kill the badass orc that has the key which you would have liked to avoid...