If you ask me, twinking is necessary. Why not? Who does it cause harm to? It's a show of how much money you have made during your travels, or a show of how much you are willing to farm lol. Anyways, it hurts no one to twink, in fact it increases the stability of any market. If we can't trade twink armor, what else are we going to trade? EQ2 kinda sucked for me because armor was junk, the only thing worth getting was crafted armor, the nameds dropped junk that wasn't worth selling on the market, it was just horrible. I prefer to have a low end market. Make the raid loot no trade, quested, no trade, otherwise, let us trade it all.
Sure, a lot of people complain about twinking, of which i don't understand, everyone is welcome to have their own opinion, but look at the EQ market, and the fact that there were level 20 mobs that offered gear worthy of high end raids, mobs that had 3 or 4 different drops from rare to common, and it wasn't unheard of a level 60 going to a level 20 zone for an item they wanted badly enough. Or spells that dropped from specific mobs at the same time. The market was blooming with different types of gear, and different ways to build your character.
That's what I want to see out of a game, that's what will keep me coming back every day, and what will have me wanting to scour noob zones for nameds and keep the adventure alive, even when I am max level.
You can do have a rich gets richer scheme without having OP toons, PL spells, and just broken game mechanics. Just because something has existed for 19 years doesnt meant it isnt broken. EQ is and was an originally released broken game. Getting a fungi and two Scepters of Destruction at level 1 that proc... you tell me the game isnt broken.
Iksar said:If a group were a six person bicycle, bringing in a twinked out player (with no balancing/scaling) would be like slapping a motor onto the thing. Sure you could pedal hard but it won't really make a difference, all you really have to do is steer at that point.
That was a fantastic analogy!! :)
BamBam said: Ehm Kreed99 i have head all there is to hear from VR So i do not think I do. VR have said that an item CAN be used by a lower lvl char. But it will scale down, it will still be a great benefit, but we won't see the fullys scaled item on a low lvl char. There you have it, maybe you misunderstood something frankly do not know.
I may have worded it wrong. I was speaking about how on stream they commented that they want many items to be tradable, and scale to match the player level. To be honest, i wasn't replying to you, i was replying to another post. But the same applies.
MauvaisOeil said:All we know is that weapon damage will be capped by your character's skill, meaning you won't be able to take full advantage of a powerfull weapon on a low level toon.
While this is indeed correct, a high quality higher level weapon used by a low level character could still prove better than an average or low quality low level weapon. We all know that high level items have better baseline stats and more overall stats (resists, stat bonuses, etc) where low level items nearly always tend to lack them. Even with the stat reductions, those higher level items essentially grow stronger as the player levels. Thus the player does not need to think about replacing that weapon until it reaches the optimal level of that weapon. During all those intervening levels, the player effectively saves all the costs and expense associated with upgrades. It is something that many take into consideration when passing down items.
I get the feeling twinking wont be needed in pantheon to allow a player to overcome their lack of skill in the class they chose. I think each class will be challenging enough and good players easily disernable using normal gear that the game provides. I sont think each class will be easy to pick up, like it was say,in EQ.
In the beginning, in EQ1 is where Brad learned this important lesson about an open game with few rules and twinking.
In the beginning, they had very few character restrictions in place. A level 10 charcter could go anywhere.
And Brad learned that having no rules allowed for the exploitation of weak mechanics.
Certain over-powered guilds groups, in the early days would ultimately dominate planes and become fully equipped in planar gear to the point they would ferry in their lowbie alts to soak up all the rotting drops. this led to level 10 characters running around with full planar nodrop gear, and epic weapons. And though the weapon damage may have been reduced for a lower level character, they were still vastly more useful than the common rusty weapons most had. But it also had the undesired affect of demoralizing average players just trying hard to get passing gear.
This ultimately led to the simple fix, that would be just another "special mechanic fix" to an otherwise open world sandbox. They made access to planes level restricted to 46.
The point of course, that those players were doing the ultimate twink, outfitting starting characters with the best in game gear.
Twinking is not a great thing. Earning gear is vastly more satisfying. Twinking is close to p2w in my book.
Manouk said:I get the feeling twinking wont be needed in pantheon to allow a player to overcome their lack of skill in the class they chose.
It isn't a question about if it is needed. It is if there is even the appearance of having an edge, however slight, over using gear normally obtained at the present level.\
[zewtastic said:Twinking is not a great thing. Earning gear is vastly more satisfying. Twinking is close to p2w in my book.
Going to break this out per sentence: Yes, it is not a great thing. In your opinion. But you, the player did earn the items and did not pay real money to obtain it without effort.
Vandraad said:Going to break this out per sentence: Yes, it is not a great thing. In your opinion. But you, the player did earn the items and did not pay real money to obtain it without effort.
No, the player on that character did not earn the items, the player on another character earned the items. It's not much different than just buying all the items for a character.
Playing a game of this nature, in the spirit it is intended, does not mean running around with a max level character farming uber loot for all your alts.
I think it's kinda unfair to be equating twinking to high level arse holes hoarding gear for their alts. I personally feel like that's boring.
Much more fun to use the trade system to turn smaller amounts of money into bigger amounts of money, and also kill rare spawns for rare valuable loots as I level up, and then use the money to twink myself and level up my tradeskills to further twink myself. If that doesn't count to you as "earning gear", then I can't help you.
It really sucks when there's level limits and whatnot. I get that it's to stop high levels from twinking friends and alts, but it also makes earning tons of cash early on effectively pointless.
The current plan to make really high level gears less effective due to character limitations is plenty, in my opinion, and it doesn't alienate my trade-before-experience playstyle.