EQ3 was started then scrapped. It was rebadged EQN and restarted, then scrapped and restared as EQN+LM, then scrapped forever.
EQ1 was what got us all here (thanks Brad, btw). But what can we learn and apply to THIS game THIS time around?
I love VR's vision that they don't want to make a WOW-killer. Those huge successes don't exist anymore. Instead they want to cater to a small niche customer base who want the original "You're in our world now" experience and feel.
OK, here are a couple business thoughts:
Charge a lot. Seriously. Back in 1999, we paid something like $40 for the game and $14/month to subscribe. Charge enough to stay afloat. If it's another $5 or $10 per month to assure this world will be here for a long time, I bet everyone of us niche customers would pay it. With inflation, EQ1 would have launched at $26/mo today. Charging $25/month is just equal to inflation. Charge $30 per month to subscribe. No micro-transactions and in-game purchases. Get your money the "original" way from customers.
Release small and early. Don't make the same mistake of trying to reach for the moon and losing your window of opportunity. Remember, EQ1 was relatively small when it launched and it grew steadily. Also, don't realease too much too fast, remember folks loved the way this genre sarted. Resist the temptation to cater to the race-to-the-top that ruined the genre.
I am not against paying any subscription up to maybe 30$, I would however note though that while you may account for inflation in your subscription price estimate, the truth of the matter is the average american hasn't seen a pay increase to match inflation in over 20 years. So while inflation may be changing things, people really dont have more money than they had in 1999, on the average.
I agree that user costs should be kept reasonable but remember that the driving force behind subscription price is profit. These nice folks developing this game for us would like a steady income to care of themselves and loved ones. Additionally I want them to pull in enough money to provide updates, correct bugs, add expansions... I would think a subscrption price of $19.99/month, with an opportunity to lower that amount via buying blocks of playtime up front, would be fair, possibly $24.99/month. Ultimately I'm sure someone is in charge of this important decision and will weigh all factors. Oh and inflation in the U.S. has been about 36% since 1999.
IF (which I hope it does) me paying 30 bucks a month secured solid consistent content I would be all over it in a heartbeat.
Xanier
I think it would be kinda stupid if they had a subscription cost of $30. Some of us have family members which we need to pay for like me. I will probably need to pay for up to 2-4 persons. I would prefer a subscription cost of $15 up to max $20, but would prefer $15. We need also to think about how many we would like to play the game with? Do we want the zones to be desert empty or filled with lots of players. As it's a group focused game it's important that we have many to group up with even 6 monthes later after the release.
Maybe start with $15 and if it gets very popular and fun to play... increase it to $20 (max) 6-12 monthes later.
VR seems set for $15 on regular servers, doesn't rule out an increased subscription level to play on a Legends-type server in the future.
Right since we are talking on the Buisness side of things like inflation etc.
1999 was then, things were diffrent example: my Farther was a single income parent who could keep everything afloat. The standards of living were diffrent then. There were only few companys back then that offered Bandwith / Internet etc.
The world has become alot more diffrent. The cost of living have gone up to a point were it is hard to get by for most people. Most familys have double incomes, some even have 2 -3 Jobs just to get by. Plus not everywhere are the standards of living equal. Also there are more and more people loosing there jobs and having to cut back on a lot of things too.
In europe we are at a 0.0 Base Rate meaning inflation is gonna kill us in the coming months.
Internet etc might be getting cheaper and cheaper but the cost of living and maybe raising a family aren`t so to compare the 2 is quite unfair.
And i am in no way saying they shouldn`t charge of corse they should but it has to be realistic.
This is where marketing comes in handy and where they would need to analyze the markets and find critical points for demand.
charge 20, 30 or 40 $ and really have a niche of players or charge 10, 15 $ and have a bigger number of players with a niche majority of players who play the game regulary.
Its all about balancing.
Everything cost alot of money it goes both ways. They have costs and we have costs (and not to sound like a jerk....The diffrence is they get rich or die trying doing it / Or that should be their goal anyway) Its in a buisnesses intrest to make a profit or they shouldn`t be doing this. But there is a right and wrong way to do it, just look at the other comapny that has just gone tits up and is now trying everything to repair the damages and pushing out the other product they had in the works to try and make some money and salvage things. (They are gonna feel it in the coming months maybe a year or 2) whos name i will not say but people should know what i am talking about.
So just to cap it off. I am in support of paying a reasonable price for the base game anywhere between 40-60$ and anywhere between 30-50$ for expansions (depends on what that includes) and a subscription monthly of 10-15$ because that ensures us and them of a stable income every month that they can slowly work with to ensure us quality content.
If they charge me $15 month, and life gets busy, or I get burned out, I take a break, and in a month or a 2 I return.
If they charge me $20 month, and life gets busy, I consider suspending or cancelling my subscription until I feel like returning, which if I'm not still paying I may not return, or extend my break longer until I am sure I am ready to return.
Charge me $25 dollars, and I start to not only question if I am playing often enough to warrant paying $25/mo, but if/when I take a break I most assuredly will cancel and resubscribing is even less likely.
I took a break from EQ1, when it was 12.99/mo for like 4-5 months, but never dropped my subscription, but if that was closer to $20+ I promise you I would have cancelled, and possibly never returned. And I carried my EQ subscription got close to a year after I had completely stopped playing in case I wanted to log back in.
I play games for the entertainment, and to break up the doldrums of daily crap. It's an escape, and I find it more entertaining that watching television. I also have a lot of other things going on, so my playtime can be erratic, I may play 5 nights 3-4 hours a night one week and then just 1 for 2 hours the next. When the cost to maintain a subscription to play gets too high to carry when I'm not playing, I have to justify that cost. And I am sure I am not the only one that is in this type of situation.
I'm all for them making a profit and providing necessary funds to keep the game running, and I trust they have a pulse on what that magic number is to maintain the game, and maintain enough players to make the game fun.
This of course is just my opinion and my situation, everyones is different. 100,000 players where 60,000 regularly log in at $15 is the same as 60,000 paying $25. Wouldn't we rather still enjoy the game while paying less, and letting the "part time players" subsidize some fo the cost? :)
hoax said:$30 a month? I don't think many people would spend that.
I would ;)
Medjai said:This has been discussed in many threads already.
Yep, this topic has been discussed... a lot :) Brad already said :"But at this point, the plan is (for regular servers at least) to charge $15. I think it would be foolish of us to proclaim 'we are a premium MMO and therefore we are going to charge everyone more! I do like the idea of being thought of as a premium MMO developer -- but I think we have to earn that respect first.'" https://www.pantheonmmo.com/content/forums/topic/2564/subscription-model/view/post_id/37005
Zarriya said:Medjai said:This has been discussed in many threads already.
Yep, this topic has been discussed... a lot :) Brad already said :"But at this point, the plan is (for regular servers at least) to charge $15. I think it would be foolish of us to proclaim 'we are a premium MMO and therefore we are going to charge everyone more! I do like the idea of being thought of as a premium MMO developer -- but I think we have to earn that respect first.'" https://www.pantheonmmo.com/content/forums/topic/2564/subscription-model/view/post_id/37005
Yes and with that said the discussion is pointless to a point. But i see us here asking the wrong question here. Ask yourself the question why you quit subscribing to a game in the first place.
It only comes down to money when we factor in the the game mechanics. The core game changed so much to what i bought into (dumbdown) or became less fun, community behaviour changed, quality of content from the developer side has lost its appeal, it only has to do with the price when it comes down to these factors.
Yes charging a price like 30$ will put alot of people off me included if it were that case. But then we factor in again: Is the game that much fun that it warrants such a price, do i get quality value for that price, do i have time to invest to play.
And after hearing the players that are playing it from the start or friends and so on is when we the outsiders who thought the price was to steep then consider trying it for a month anyway. Some stay some don`t. So i don`t think this is something any of us should be asking.We say to ourselfs 30$ once ain`t gonna hurt that much i will try it and see if it is that good as everyone says.
We should be asking the developers to here what we are saying when we are unhappy with the product delievered and hope they listen and try and adapt to what the majority of players are complaining about. Because at the end of the day if we don`t play it they don`t get paid. And even this is a tricky one to handle. Where do we draw a line for listening. A lot of MMOs got dumbed down because of them listening to the players also.
But if they spoke to us about what they have planned for updates/patches/expansions/subscribtions before they do it so we can say what we as a majority like and dislike instead of just going BOOM he is this and that then have the crying start and ranting and flamming etc might just be the solution.
Thats why the other company is now feeling the pain to some point because the stopped communicating with the players and made changes as they saw fit without telling us why it has to be that why. Only if you ask i can help you. Be silent and fall apart.
This is where alot of developers make mistakes. Most of them don`t spend the time thinking of things like this when it comes to subscriber loss. They only try to surrogate the damages done to them.
Yarnila said:Zarriya said:Medjai said:This has been discussed in many threads already.
Yep, this topic has been discussed... a lot :) Brad already said :"But at this point, the plan is (for regular servers at least) to charge $15. I think it would be foolish of us to proclaim 'we are a premium MMO and therefore we are going to charge everyone more! I do like the idea of being thought of as a premium MMO developer -- but I think we have to earn that respect first.'" https://www.pantheonmmo.com/content/forums/topic/2564/subscription-model/view/post_id/37005
Yes and with that said the discussion is pointless to a point. But i see us here asking the wrong question here. Ask yourself the question why you quit subscribing to a game in the first place.
Is it pointless though? if the dev's and powers that be read these forums to see what we are thinking and saying a good point that's made is just that and may help the game in some way shape or form.
Xanier