Insert any word you feel is appropriate. Mine is "work" just so that this doesnt get deleted.
I for one am tired of the total lack of anything at all from VR. I am tired of complaining into the ether. I guess I will give up now and keep half an eye on my inbox for something to come through. But if VR cannot interact with its customers, what's the point in promoting this game to anyone else? For now. I'm done!
They had said in a different forum that at least some of us could expect some unspecified news within a couple of months. They said this a couple of months ago.
I agree that communications lately have been ...imperfect.
I could say I am an optimist and think they are building up to something major that will change many things.
I could say I am a pessimist and think they are building up to something major that will change many things.
Neither is true - I have no information to support either hope or despair. But I do have patience - all Gods know that Pantheon development has been a very effective training device for teaching patience.
Teleokenisis said:Really wondering when this beautiful game will be Beta, i have a pledge for 150$ that i did about 4-5 years ago. Would love to do some of the testing!
It is still in pre-alpha and has been since 2016/2017 if that gives you any idea when Beta might show up.
Yeah, I honestly wouldnt expect anything until maybe November. I hope that the state of the game on the 12th brings up some good news for us, but most of us we'll have to wait until the 26th to hear anything new about the game. For now we sit..., and wait..., and make discussion on these forums that will likely blow away in the wind.
chenzeme said:Insert any word you feel is appripriate. Mine is "work" just so that this doesnt get deleted.
I for one am tired of the total lack of anything at all from VR. I am tired of complaining into the ether. I guess I will give up now and keep half an eye on my inbox for something to come through. But if VR cannot interact with its customers, what's the point in promoting this game to anyone else? For now. I'm done!
I feel you. So much silence.
Thank you for a great line:
"Being promised Alien, getting Pikachu."
Teleokenisis said:Really wondering when this beautiful game will be Beta, i have a pledge for 150$ that i did about 4-5 years ago. Would love to do some of the testing!
Sadly you won't have to worry about that.
Mark my words, this game is not getting out of Pre-Alpha.
All the people who pledged for Alpha access, burned.
All the people who pledged for Beta access, burned.
Everyone who invested in this venture, burned.
They have months if not weeks before the doors close for good and they "thank everyone for their support".
In the meantime, the cynical switch to cartoon graphics will scrounge up a few bucks from excited pre-teens donating their parents money.
Its over.
The next time you see extended game play footage you will understand.
Ezrael said: You’re just being utterly toxic recently lotuss79. Your comments aren’t helpful or worthwhile in any way. You should probably go and spend your time doing something else in life, clear your head, come back a more mature, positive and grown up person.
I appreciate why you would hate what im saying.
But just wait until you see actual game play footage (not a staged presentation video).
My head is quite clear. And there is nothing to be positive about right now.
A dramatic course correction is needed immediately or its over.
lotuss79 said:Ezrael said: You’re just being utterly toxic recently lotuss79. Your comments aren’t helpful or worthwhile in any way. You should probably go and spend your time doing something else in life, clear your head, come back a more mature, positive and grown up person.
I appreciate why you would hate what im saying.
But just wait until you see actual game play footage (not a staged presentation video).
My head is quite clear. And there is nothing to be positive about right now.
A dramatic course correction is needed immediately or its over.
This simply isn't true. Plain and simple.
The part you did say though "Just wait until you see actual game play footage" is correct. Clearly the reception to the art style was not what they hoped it would be, but we haven't seen nearly enough to know how well it does or does not work for the game. We need to see a lot more. I do think they should have shown a lot more already though. It's kind of awkard to just let this situation boil over and show nothing and say nothing.
From a software development point of view, all that has been done (and publicly known) so far has made sense to me. First the major refactor a few years ago, to make the game-build more scalable, and now the change in art style and assets to make development faster and the game-build more performant. I agree with the changes, even though the new art isn't super appealing to me.
However, the major problem here, in my view, is the lack of frequent and impactful communication.
The lack of content in July and August I can understand, given that people go on vacation, need to take care of the kids etc, as well as VR being small indie team. But September was also poor, and October is following suit, in a crucial moment when you probably should be pumping out more videos and more producer articles so that gamers and investors interested in Pantheon can be rest assured that things are going well, despite another refactor in the project.
That 5min video was fine, but very insufficient in a time like this
Kaynrath said:However, the major problem here, in my view, is the lack of frequent and impactful communication.
The lack of content in July and August I can understand, given that people go on vacation, need to take care of the kids etc, as well as VR being small indie team. But September was also poor, and October is following suit, in a crucial moment when you probably should be pumping out more videos and more producer articles so that gamers and investors interested in Pantheon can be rest assured that things are going well, despite another refactor in the project.
That 5min video was fine, but very insufficient in a time like this
The worst part of your point re coms is that we have multiple people in multiple roles that centre around communication. To be just visually silent now.. at this moment just boggles. To not be like you said pumping out content is crazy. Content aimed to put the extremely high levels of long term backer unrest and confusion to bed. Irrelevent of peoples preference on the art style, to come out swinging in September with this level of quality update fell so short of almost everyones expectation. Presumably the september update was the best they can do (and i mean if your not putting your best foot forward in a build up to a "reveal" like that then what on earth are you doing?) it was so far below where it needed to be, you just have to assume the level of understanding on how to read a room and then also how to communicate with said room is non existant. It leads me to believe that they are certain that people in the community will hang on no matter what. But man thats a hell of a damn risky tight rope to walk.
I think they should just focus on getting the content made, and not worry about retarded videos or updates. Go dark until they get close to alpha then announce that and let the game speak for itself. Way to much talk and not enough action. Some of the most viral games are when the game just comes into early access and people are pleasantly surprised.
Razorbrains said:
I think they should just focus on getting the content made, and not worry about retarded videos or updates. Go dark until they get close to alpha then announce that and let the game speak for itself. Way to much talk and not enough action. Some of the most viral games are when the game just comes into early access and people are pleasantly surprised.
Hard to agree with this statement since the very existence of this project is entirely built on trust.
To my knowledge, there is no self-funding here (as opposed to Ashes of Creation for example)
Pledges come from the average gamer. You dish out whatever amount of money you're willing to spend to help fund the development and what you get back is nothing more than a promise. As far as I know, there are no legal mechanisms here to help get your money back if the project goes under. That is the nature of a pledge.
This whole ordeal exists because a bunch of gamers believe in a vision for a high-fantasy MMORPG.
If VR does not reinforce that vision in the eyes of gamers through constant video content and good informative written articles trust wanes and, consequently, so does the funding.
The way I see it, there is simply no other way around it for Pantheon.
Man, I am being drawn in again. Shees.
Razorbrains: I think they should just focus on getting the content made, and not worry about retarded videos or updates. Go dark until they get close to alpha then announce that and let the game speak for itself.
Kaynrath: Hard to agree with this statement since the very existence of this project is entirely built on trust.
I cannot agree that going dark is the way forward. Trust is indeed important and VR would not be here without our trust in their vision. From day one VR's premise was openess and discussion. Going dark is neither. This change did not considered our trust.
I think the total opposite of going dark is required. We need reassurance that they have everything covered, whether we like the change or not. They need to let us know they are still there, have listened and are continuing with their plans and what those plans look like. Going dark would just show them to be the same as every other games company. How can we trust that?
chenzeme said:I think the total opposite of going dark is required. We need reassurance that they have everything covered, whether we like the change or not. They need to let us know they are still there, have listened and are continuing with their plans and what those plans look like. Going dark would just show them to be the same as every other games company. How can we trust that?
I am not certain of their funding requirements from current pledges. However I would imagine pledges are just a trickle now anyways. Getting to Alpha would likely bring in WAY more pledges and probably investor funding. Progress is the way forward, I think most people are tired of all the talk by now. Talk talk talk for years. Someone needs to pickup this turtle and drive it over the finish line.
I understand your point in that they could just go dark and still make no progress, then who will hold them accountable? I dont see this as anything different than where we are now. Game is almost a decade in development and still no end in sight. So all these show and tells have done what for development? Absolutely nothing.
Razorbrains said:I think they should just focus on getting the content made, and not worry about retarded videos or updates. Go dark until they get close to alpha then announce that and let the game speak for itself. Way to much talk and not enough action. Some of the most viral games are when the game just comes into early access and people are pleasantly surprised.
You would think they want to use the people they are paying for the roles in social media, community manager and video producer. You would think that they can d record/screenshot some sort of in game content during testing phases without disrupting Dev flow
Hokanu said:Razorbrains said:I think they should just focus on getting the content made, and not worry about retarded videos or updates. Go dark until they get close to alpha then announce that and let the game speak for itself. Way to much talk and not enough action. Some of the most viral games are when the game just comes into early access and people are pleasantly surprised.
You would think they want to use the people they are paying for the roles in social media, community manager and video producer. You would think that they can d record/screenshot some sort of in game content during testing phases without disrupting Dev flow
This! It doesnt take much to show they are still progressing.
chenzeme said:Hokanu said:Razorbrains said:I think they should just focus on getting the content made, and not worry about retarded videos or updates. Go dark until they get close to alpha then announce that and let the game speak for itself. Way to much talk and not enough action. Some of the most viral games are when the game just comes into early access and people are pleasantly surprised.
You would think they want to use the people they are paying for the roles in social media, community manager and video producer. You would think that they can d record/screenshot some sort of in game content during testing phases without disrupting Dev flow
This! It doesnt take much to show they are still progressing.
Why would they show such a short video, with almost nothing in it and then go absolutely dead silent?
For one, they probably got a much different reaction than they were expecting. They've probably been going through a lot of work to try to bring the new art style closer to realistic, since that's the resounding complaint and hope from both negative and positive posts. Let's say that is the case, if they are doing this, it would make sense that we wouldn't see anything, since they don't have anything yet to show. The shortness of that video does not make any logical sense for any reason other than they wanted to do this on purpose to gauge initial reactions to a small amount of content, so they could see what direction to take it before they got too deep in. *all speculation*
However I bet we will see something within the next 2 weeks, with a much bigger reveal than the 2 minutes of video and 3 minutes of screenshots we got last time. Why do I think this? Because it's extremely awkward to leave the community with that short video and say nothing. They want us to love their game and keep pledging, so they want to make sure the next reveal is something we love and will want to continue pledging for. It's the only logical reason I can come up with too.
That would be logical, but im less than 100% certain they're playing 3D chess over there.
I think its more likely that after 6 months (working on this since May!) that this is the best they could come up with.
Rather than intentionally holding back as part of a comprehensive strategy.
And this change was somehow supposed to speed up development.
I agree though, they definitely got a different reaction then they were expecting.
Option 3, take it all as face value.
They are probably taking notes on small changes they can make(color scheme and stuff like that), but trying to plead/bargain/talk to everyonee while they are screaming at the top of their lungs is a futile move. Any parent with a child in the middle of a temper tantrum knows what I am talking about hehe.
I think they will wait for initial raw reaction calms a bit and talk a bit more about it. There is no doubt they knew changing it this way would have a big reaction one way or another, they just have to let it play out before responding. When they do though, I don't think they are going to announce changing much about it, just that they will make it a bit darker, a bit grittier, and that improving the lighting will make it even better.
I can't wait to hear more, but I completely understand the silence they have at this moment about the style change.
As for the rest of the path to alpha stuff, it didn't really do much for me one way or another so I didn't care that they stopped, but I can see how other people liked seeing it. I hope they implement something to share the progress again (hopefully in a way that is more palatable for me).