Yes, but I would hope to find lore or have them used in some sort of quest later on. The cave in a hard to reach place with a long dead mage would be an interesting find. Possibly finding a lore book / spell / recipe / map that has survived the ravages of time or possibly the cave turns out to be a location for a mage class or crafter quest later on in the game you or a friend may need to find later on. Magic protects the cave entrance, scaring off wildlife still after all these years can be studied, all sorts of cool ideas to be tracked. A lost locket at the bottom of a well that starts a quest to find its owner. Crawling through the small tunnel to find it opens up into a shortcut. Exploring the world is a big part of any game.
A few locations can be nothing but a cool view, but it better be a good one.
What I won't do though is go explore a zone full of gray mobs. The absolute safety takes the fun out of exploring. May as well have noclip on.
Finding quests not in a book or on a questboard somewhere while travelling is fine, as it does lead to a sense of curiosity and wonder about the world; but having a list of places of interst and offering even the smallest thing for finding them all...no, I don't like it. Sure, I mean my OCD will demand, beg, and force me to go to these places; but I will not enjoy it in the slightest. The only satisfaction I would honestly get is when it's over and done with. Again, stumbling upon a quest that is not given by an NPC of some sort, or in a quest log, or however that plays out is a lot different in that regard. Though the only thing I say to that then is don't tie a massive or game altering reward onto it. Maybe give a bit of coin or a small trinket, but nothing like godly armor or weapon, materials or a recipe to make something overtly superior to anything else in the game.
To me, they're a fundamental component of what makes a world feel immersive.
Also, in a game which has no in-game map functionality, you need waypoints / points of interest, simply to aid in navigating the world, and for other things, such as finding group members (and vice versa).
Love seeing POIs and being able to set my sights on them. Love looking for less obvious POIs and investigating them. Love discovering POIs that I wasn't looking for at all.
Yeah, it's tempting to just keep on leveling when you find a good spot, but I truly hope two things happen in Pantheon: 1) VR put in a ton of 'stuff to explore', 2) I resist the grind and make the effort to do what I *know* is more rewarding: Exploration and discovery.
It seems that whenever a game is first released, I tend to move incrementally in a linear manner solely based on the next closest mob or group of mobs I bump into that provide experience. I don't look online to see what the optimal places to level are. I just let the game take me where it will arbitrarily. I tend to miss a lot of content during my first play through because of this, but honestly, I find the journey much more enjoyable when I just go where the wind takes me.
It's only after I've done this a few times that I tend to start gravitating toward a more targeted approach to content, but even then it's usually based on areas (POI) I found to be the most aesthetically pleasing, rather than some sort of Keeping Up with the Joneses type of mentality that others seem to find enjoyment in.
Kilsin said:Community Debate - Do Points Of Interest (POI) and other secret locations around the map make you want to travel over to them and see what's there? Or do you just power through and clear a zone of what you need then move on? #MMORPG #CommunityMatters
Absolutely. I love to explore in addition to adventuring.
Kilsin said:Community Debate - Do Points Of Interest (POI) and other secret locations around the map make you want to travel over to them and see what's there? Or do you just power through and clear a zone of what you need then move on? #MMORPG #CommunityMatters
It depends upon what is interesting about that particular point. If it just a scenic overlook, I'll pass. Fighting NPCs, obtaining spells, items, gear, completing quests are what interest me. So if a PoI has those things associated with it, I'll find myself looking to find those PoIs otherwise I'll just skip it.
Depends on how the game is set up. If isolated hill tops, ruins and caves look pretty but never have anything useful in them, it won't take me long to stop looking at them. If even a *small* percentage have some item to pick up or skill to learn or NPC to tell me something or the like I will explore with greater interest.
I note the obvious - in today's world where everything goes quickly onto a wiki or other on-line compendium the things I mention should be randomized. If I know that in a particular zone there is a hermit at 157x 122 y and a book at -312x and 17y and nothing else - there is absolutely no incentive to explore all the places that I know have nothing. At least after a while when I have confidence that if something was there someone else would have found it.
I prefer to discover things naturally, I like interesting map features, such as the artwork for a region might indicate a dangerous area or an area of treasure through subtle graphical clues, but a POI marker is a no, but I also don't like quest and would rather just go out an explore an area as I kill things, I don't like quests telling me what to do and would rather be spontaneous.
Points of interest yes. On a map? No, a dot is just a dot for me. If you want to name a point of interest, do it by other means (signs or npc's describing the road ahead).
I'm up for exploring the world, but not so much by means of following the not as dotted line...
Kilsin said: Community Debate - Do Points Of Interest (POI) and other secret locations around the map make you want to travel over to them and see what's there?
I am confused. A POI to me is an indicator on a map, and it appears to be how you are using the term here.
I THOUGHT that VR wasn't going to be giving us maps.
In the game world - and out in Nature in the real world - every unique place is an interesting place to me. A grove of trees, a sheltered hollow in the woods, a small hilltop, they are all 'Places of Interest' to me. I want to go there and see every one of them.
But putting POI indicators on a map takes away even more of the challenge than just giving us the map in the first place. It's like adding a 'you are here' icon to it.
I'm fine with or without ingame maps. IF you decide to provide maps, PLEASE don't cover them with POI icons.
Jothany said:Kilsin said: Community Debate - Do Points Of Interest (POI) and other secret locations around the map make you want to travel over to them and see what's there?I am confused. A POI to me is an indicator on a map, and it appears to be how you are using the term here.
I always took it to mean discovery xp, possibly a name that pops up. "You have discovered Kilsin's lookout"
Jobeson said: I always took it to mean discovery xp, possibly a name that pops up. "You have discovered Kilsin's lookout"
That could certainly be the meaning. Though if there is anything worth discovering there, I'd still rather not have the place marked on the map, but just left for me to discover.
(Personally, I'd rather discover 'Kilsin's Dreamcrushing Hammer of Moderation' than his hideout LoL)
Of course POIs. interest me. and the Preception System better be robust with it. Pings and POI's go hand in hand, or at least they should. different ones at night, different one at diffent level ranges, different ones based on faction, day/night, your class and quests. A player will to test these all the different conditions should be rewarded.
I know POI's are big in 'modern' MMO design, but I don't care if they are in or not. I remember during devleopment of Vanguard, Brad talked about POI's a lot, how any point on the map should have one, and I couldn't really say that the world design was any more interesting because of it. Reason being, once you encounter the POI it's no longer a POI. Therefore, why worry about it when building the world? Build a world that is sustainable and feels organic to the region you are in. Forcing a developer to include POI for only the intial benefit to the player isn't worth it IMO.
I pay significantly more attention to the landscape of a zone and any POI when they aren't marked on a map or mini-map. Generally if I have a map detailed enough that it's pointing out POI, then it's probably pointing out quest information or other information that dictates a lot of how I play the game and limits organic exploration. That being said, I do enjoy hidden places or other POI and exploring and finding them as I level in that particular zone.
I usually just power through unless I really like the journey of a game.
Breath of the Wild, for example, had tons of POIs, and I only explored them, again, because it was an amazing game and I wanted it to take as long as possible to win.
WoW on the other hand...Definately just powered through.
I like POI's especially if they are needed as destination points or waystations for other reasons that are only eluded to, making the players themselves the perception system.
An ogre, heading to Dwarf land asking about a chessboard? kind of thing. Humans in need of a quest heading to a seperate palace with other humans of another race and inquiring about a wisp island? and...cats?
Hints, in starting places of other places that are obvious to people in those places but not to those of other places. if Im phrasing that correctly.
Jothany said:In the game world - and out in Nature in the real world - every unique place is an interesting place to me. A grove of trees, a sheltered hollow in the woods, a small hilltop, they are all 'Places of Interest' to me. I want to go there and see every one of them.
Same for me. In addition, it would be cool if such locations could also be "safe" spots (in so far as mobs would normally not wander there, but of course it might still be possible to train them there). So that you can enjoy the scenery and rest for a moment.
Jobeson said:Jothany said:Kilsin said: Community Debate - Do Points Of Interest (POI) and other secret locations around the map make you want to travel over to them and see what's there?I am confused. A POI to me is an indicator on a map, and it appears to be how you are using the term here.
I always took it to mean discovery xp, possibly a name that pops up. "You have discovered Kilsin's lookout"
Yes, this is what I meant roughly, doesn't;t appear on the map or if it does, it shows as an unknown location symbol, upon arrival it could be anything from an abandoned campsite with suspicious contents in a rucksack, a great view with a note left on the ground, some blood and tracks leading off into the wood, a beautiful but forgotten swimming hole with a bottle at the bottom of the lake etc.
There may be exp just for finding it, the start of a quest if you choose to investigate, just a screenshot worthy view or a potential lead for a spell or ability.
Kilsin said:
There may be exp just for finding it.
I'm not a big fan of different forms of experience all funneling into a characters main leveling experience. For me, it always waters down that achievement feeling I get when I finally do level. I would much rather see POI experience go towards something like a cartography or a prospecting skill.
Nekentros said:Kilsin said:
There may be exp just for finding it.
I'm not a big fan of different forms of experience all funneling into a characters main leveling experience. For me, it always waters down that achievement feeling I get when I finally do level. I would much rather see POI experience go towards something like a cartography or a prospecting skill.
*Cough* keeper entries *Cough*
Jobeson said:Jothany said:Kilsin said: Community Debate - Do Points Of Interest (POI) and other secret locations around the map make you want to travel over to them and see what's there?I am confused. A POI to me is an indicator on a map, and it appears to be how you are using the term here.
I always took it to mean discovery xp, possibly a name that pops up. "You have discovered Kilsin's lookout"
I'm reminded of the neat little side-quest in Oblivion when one discovered the no-horse town of "Hack Dirt". that was a cool POI.