chenzeme said:
You can never appease everybody and any business that tries will fail. So the argument that you can not include everybody's holiday in the game as an argument as to why you should not include any holiday makes no sense. Pantheon will not make every gamer happy so why have them make a game? Pantheon will not make every MMO player happy so why make an MMO?
Do I believe in-game holidays should be lore based? Yes, I would love to see that. Maybe Pantheon decides that celebrating Day of the Dead is more lore-based for a specific race than Halloween. All that I ask of Pantheon is if they include real-life holidays into the game only have them celebrated by races that would normally celebrate that type of holiday (Funny enough, will require less dev time since they do not need to decorate every city for an event).
Chogar: So the argument that you can not include everybody's holiday in the game as an argument as to why you should not include any holiday makes no sense.
Just because you dont agree with the argument doesnt mean it "makes no sense". Of course it makes sense. So how do you choose? If you only choose some of your game player demographic holidays, you will make other players unhappy and unhappy players are vocal. Just because you cant do something doesnt mean the point is moot. RL holidays are of no importance in game terms and I would like to see effort put into lore based content, not to replicate whats around you in RL.
I reiterate, why spend resources on something that only some of the player base will enjoy rather than making unique content that all of the player base can enjoy?
chenzeme said:Chogar: So the argument that you can not include everybody's holiday in the game as an argument as to why you should not include any holiday makes no sense.
Just because you dont agree with the argument doesnt mean it "makes no sense". Of course it makes sense. So how do you choose? If you only choose some of your game player demographic holidays, you will make other players unhappy and unhappy players are vocal. Just because you cant do something doesnt mean the point is moot. RL holidays are of no importance in game terms and I would like to see effort put into lore based content, not to replicate whats around you in RL.
I reiterate, why spend resources on something that only some of the player base will enjoy rather than making unique content that all of the player base can enjoy?
It makes no sense because it is a no-win situation.
Add holidays to the game? Yes: Somebody will not be happy. No: Somebody will not be happy. Unwinnable. Let us not even go down the cultural appropriation if VR did add holidays not part of their heritage.
Using resources on different content instead of holidays is a good direction to go for an argument.
Since I am coming to this discussion that is now 3 pages deep, I am just going to quote a few people that have stated what I was thinking:valhalla said:
Repetitivevthorm said:
...if you still feel the need to add holiday or seasonal events, please make them relevant to the game world, not the real one.eunichron said:
I oppose the inclusion of real world holidays for two reasons; that I would not want anyone to feel left out, for one cultural tradition being over-represented than another, and because I would like VR to be more creative than just plagiarizing traditions that already exist.chenzeme said:
I reiterate, why spend resources on something that only some of the player base will enjoy rather than making unique content that all of the player base can enjoy?
I enjoy real life holidays being transposed in some manner befitting the game lore.
Edit:
...Wow made my post before reading the pages of negative people whom seem like they hate holidays in general and not just in games.
arazons said:I enjoy real life holidays being transposed in some manner befitting the game lore.
Edit:
...Wow made my post before reading the pages of negative people whom seem like they hate holidays in general and not just in games.
I mean, I like holidays in general but personally I like them more when I don't have games I am into bombarding me with FOMO events when I am likely to be traveling/doing family or friend stuff.
Far better to me for games to have their own events (especially with their own themes if appropriate) during times of the year there aren't RL holidays conflicting.
Iksar said:arazons said:I enjoy real life holidays being transposed in some manner befitting the game lore.
Edit:
...Wow made my post before reading the pages of negative people whom seem like they hate holidays in general and not just in games.
I mean, I like holidays in general but personally I like them more when I don't have games I am into bombarding me with FOMO events when I am likely to be traveling/doing family or friend stuff.
Far better to me for games to have their own events (especially with their own themes if appropriate) during times of the year there aren't RL holidays conflicting.
Well I am glad that is better for you.... But that doesnt mean its necessarily better for me... I typically have more time off around the traditional western holidays so I do typically have more time to invest into in-game events and the like based on the RL holidays. Now I am not calling for direct RL holiday tradtions or anything like that. I would prefer it fit into the game world and lore. BUT the RL time frames do work better for me.
Mixed
Pros:
I enjoy seasonal variation in games since it keeps them feeling fresher and it helps mitigate the Groundhog's Day feeling that nothing ever actually changes in the world. I also really enjoy Halloween thematically and aestetically, so seeing that in games is almost alwasy welcome. I like seasonal "fun" items that are only availabe for part of the year (I like to save them and use them out of season). GM Events can be great fun. When done right, it creates a feeling of anticipation as we get closer.
Cons:
I hate it when the timeframe for the holiday content is too short because it creates a feeling of being compelled to participate in it--any event that offers limited time items/perks should be at least 6 - 8 weeks to allow us to enjoy the ambiance of it without feeling rushed. Most RL holiday events in MMOs feel either perfunctory or immersion-breaking. Many people don't like aspects of some/all holidays and don't like having their escape from reality overloaded with the most annoying parts of the reality they're trying to escape. Personally, I hate Christmas music with the passion of 1,000 burning suns and I really don't want to hear non-stop jingle-bells knock-off music on loop any time I'm in a city.
Conclusion:
Ultimately, virtually none of the things I like about holiday events requres the use of actual RL holidays. A very loosely inspired by and lore-appropriate series of events would be far better, especially if they're not coincidentally always at the same time as RL holidays. Make up some other events that are at different times of the year. If I had to pick between no events at all and only RL holiday events, I would choose RL holiday events. But I really want lore-based events, especially if they are different between the races (the Haflings should be the ones with the most garish decorations). Having the Skar celebrate winter with Skarta Claus isn't nearly as interesting as having the Skar celebrate winter with a Burning Sun celebration where they all keep fires burning everywhere and covering themselves in ash and soot. They could do this because of an ancient tradition that was meant to keep the Sun's fire from burning out in winter and the in-game event creates an interesting smoke and fire aestetic throughout Skar land, along with Skar players being able to add ash/soot smudges to their character's faces.
