Summoners Epic spell ( summon Behemoth ) . Never thought it was good idea to give us a Epic spell that goes to the enchanter .
No other class has a epic that belongs to another class , All those saying Synergy , I say BS ...I did offer up a suggestion that better suits Synergy between the two classes .
Its like Christmas , getting a gift with your name on on it , only to have it belong to someone else :)
Final answer :P
MauvaisOeil said:Direlord's plate and spiked shield could be good but I don't think it's planned.
One thing I would like is to give mana to Direlord, paladin and Ranger, like it was in EQ. However I would like them to generate and consume this ressource differently than pure caster. With active generation allowing for spell weaving, but not to the point it's either pointless or too limited.
One thing I consider currently broken, is the fact the Paladin can heal out of combat for no cost of ressource, making him a restless fighter and able to patch up his group and ease a lot of downtime for his healer. I'm all for the paladin beeing able to patch heal and ease the corners, but making his ressource for it irrelevant is not a solution to me. It will be as problematic on pvp servers where you know if a paladin got away, he will get back full life in less than a minute while you might be still low on life and mana, and it won't hinder his ability to attack.
Overall, I simply like than magic comes from mana, for every class.
That's one of my biggest concerns as well. Wayyy too many abilities and classes dependent on the whole "build up your resource to unlock this ability" mumbo jumbo. I've never liked this approach in the past and won't be playing a class that relies heavily on this design concept. If its subtle perhaps... cause otherwise it feels too arcade game like.
Also, I really hope leveling takes a loooong time compared the easy mode mmos these days.
If there was one thing, I think it would be diversity within each class. It seems the differences in each class right now will be what skills you have acquired (through trainers, or through finding them throughout the world).
My thoughts on this stemmed from warriors, who can use all these different weapons but most of their skills seem to require shields. Can a 2H warrior or a Dual Wield warrior actually work? Are their roles still as a tank or will they perform similarly to other DPS classes?
Could you run a rogue as an enchanter replacement? More focused on alchemy-esque abilities and support than on DPS?
I know its a fine line, and VR wants to keep classes unique and not blur the lines too much. I just find it odd that warriors are kinda pigeonholed into sword and board when they are allowed to wield all? weapon types.
I played EQ from the start, but I also played Project 1999 more recently. The one thing that eventually ruined Project 1999 for me was the perma camping of raid bosses. This was done mostly by the top guilds, and caused a tremendous amount of training and griefing as well as "poop socking." I hope that Pantheon has some system to avoid this. In EQ, I recall having agreements between guilds to rotate raiding bosses. This seemed to work well. I suppose instances are a last resort option, only because what I experienced in P1999 was so much worse.
Primalpat said:If there was one thing, I think it would be diversity within each class. It seems the differences in each class right now will be what skills you have acquired (through trainers, or through finding them throughout the world).
My thoughts on this stemmed from warriors, who can use all these different weapons but most of their skills seem to require shields. Can a 2H warrior or a Dual Wield warrior actually work? Are their roles still as a tank or will they perform similarly to other DPS classes?
Could you run a rogue as an enchanter replacement? More focused on alchemy-esque abilities and support than on DPS?
I know its a fine line, and VR wants to keep classes unique and not blur the lines too much. I just find it odd that warriors are kinda pigeonholed into sword and board when they are allowed to wield all? weapon types.
My guess is the skill reveal they have done is a reflection of their core role skills, and the core role of warrior is tanking and using a shield will benefit the tank considerably! But you would definitely be able to change up your weapons to 2h or Dual Wield and get some extra dps in exchange for defence, but yeah you would loose the use of those shield dependant skills. So I believe it is as you have mentioned above in your examples, a rogue could stand in on CC without a chanter around, but not to the same degree as an enchanter and like you said with a serious reduction in dps. A warrior could tank without a shield but not to the same mitigation degree as one with a shield.
I'd expect as we see more skills for the classes we start to see how a warrior could be used with an alternate weapon set with some dps related skills, but still be able to tank. Your healer might have a winge about the extra spikeyness of the tanking though :)
I understand why I will not get this wish and I deep down agree with their decision to have PVP servers. But I would love for the developers to focus 100% on PVE and not have PVP at all.
Or just get rid of the banners for the warriors I do not have a better solution in mind but there has to be a better way than panting flags all over the place.
phil85 said:I played EQ from the start, but I also played Project 1999 more recently. The one thing that eventually ruined Project 1999 for me was the perma camping of raid bosses. This was done mostly by the top guilds, and caused a tremendous amount of training and griefing as well as "poop socking." I hope that Pantheon has some system to avoid this. In EQ, I recall having agreements between guilds to rotate raiding bosses. This seemed to work well. I suppose instances are a last resort option, only because what I experienced in P1999 was so much worse.
Your point is reasonable, but Kunark->Velious on live was 7 months. P1999 spent four years on Kunark before the release of Velious and should never be used to form an opinion of how an MMO should be.
There are two that recently stuck out to me while watching the Druid Stream. Those things being CD timers and the ability "Preservers Wildfire".
Like form time. pacing, and spamming perspective I understand the use of cooldowns. However, as a healer, I personally feel that your limiting factors should be your mana pool and aggro management. Not I also have to incur a 5-second cooldown in addition to the mana loss and the aggro management. Like it is one thing to place a cooldown on an epic ability to prevent spamming and broken gameplay, its another to place it on your main direct heal.
The other thing that screamed at me was the druids AoE heal "Perserver's Wildfire". It had a shorter cooldown and what appeared to be lower mana cost the only issue is that it comes with a damage component that is capable of breaking CC. Like I can't even correctly voice how bad that is in terms of healing design. All I can say on the matter is that a healer should never be in a situation where they can't perform their job optimally because if they use a spell its a guaranteed wipe anyway. Like this spell either needs to be designed where it doesn't target CCed enemies, or the DPS component needs to be completely removed.
I think if I had to choose between the long CD periods or something like fixing "Preserver's Wildfire" My vote would go towards "Preservers Wildfire" because of interms of poor class and spell design that one hits it for me. I think the final nail in that coffin was when someone said " You guys gotta watch AOE" after the group wiped towards the end. I was honestly laughing in my chair thinking that if it was me in this situation, that comment would have been addressed and I would have has some very "pleasant" things to say about the matter.
Baldur said:...
The other thing that screamed at me was the druids AoE heal "Perserver's Wildfire". It had a shorter cooldown and what appeared to be lower mana cost the only issue is that it comes with a damage component that is capable of breaking CC. Like I can't even correctly voice how bad that is in terms of healing design. All I can say on the matter is that a healer should never be in a situation where they can't perform their job optimally because if they use a spell its a guaranteed wipe anyway. Like this spell either needs to be designed where it doesn't target CCed enemies, or the DPS component needs to be completely removed.
...
I thoroughly disagree. If a healer is always allowed to perform their job optimally, then their job never changes. Situational abilities are even more important with a limited action set system. Any argument of the form "I can't do X because the game stupidly punishes me through mechanic Y" comes from players not adapting to the game and situation at hand. You should take mechanic Y into consideration and play around it. If you have a group that isn't splitting away from CC'ed mobs or you're in a confined space, then aoe abilities might not be the right ones to bring.
The idea that the devs should actively seek to simplify abilities to make them safer to use in all situations is something I cannot abide.
Just started playing on the EQ classless emulator last night and its an absolute blast if to unstructured and too easy right now. With a little more work, some character choices, skill mastery ranks for each skill that need to be used to master it I could see it turning into something really very cool.
What that amounts to though is I wish Pantheon was going to be a skill tree based game and not a class based game. Maybe a later server could do what Classless is doing.
Ainadak said:Baldur said:I thoroughly disagree. If a healer is always allowed to perform their job optimally, then their job never changes. Situational abilities are even more important with a limited action set system. Any argument of the form "I can't do X because the game stupidly punishes me through mechanic Y" comes from players not adapting to the game and situation at hand. You should take mechanic Y into consideration and play around it. If you have a group that isn't splitting away from CC'ed mobs or you're in a confined space, then aoe abilities might not be the right ones to bring.
The idea that the devs should actively seek to simplify abilities to make them safer to use in all situations is something I cannot abide.
This ^.
Also as for the "main" druid direct heal having a cooldown, it's probably due to a couple factors: One being druid aren't intended to spam direct healing so I'd bet it's more of an "oh crap" support heal and the other being it is one of Hirode's abilities.
Grayel said:Zyellinia said:Grayel said:Dynamic scaling of content so that older zones and content remain relevant.
Terrible idea and completely anti-RPG in every way imaginable...
As for what to change, the concept of different but equal at primary role for different classes. There is no way they can balance that along with different non-primary tool-kits even if they manage to get the balance right on the primary role.
Okay, thanks for the feedback...
RPG, role-playing game: assuming the role of a character in a fictional setting, in this case a magical, fantasy fiction.
So please help me understand how dynamic scaling is anti-RPG In every possible way.
example: You run into an area at level 10 and fight goblins, kobolds, orcs or whatever the lowby mob of choice is; the encounters are somewhat challenging. You then power up to level 35 or so, acquiring better skills and gear along the way only to go back to that same area and have the fights still be just as challenging. So how is it in any way RPG consistent that you getting three to four (or more) times stronger doesn't make it easier to beat the same mobs?
One thing I would like to see changed is for the Dire Lord to be able to wear Plate Armor... Even with all of his really cool health leaching abilities I'm finding it hard to believe he will be as good of a tank as a Warrior or Paladin when all he can wear is Mail, Leather, and Cloth....
Rint
dorotea said:3. Having no instances. Having *few* instances is the right decision. But given the clear benefit to using instancing to reduce very temporary overcrowding (e.g. at release or when a new zone is added), to facilitate player housing when that is added, to help tell stories with FFXIV type cutscenes occasionally, to prevent *critical* encounters from being perma-camped by griefers or aggressive players/guilds etc. I think the stated decison that "instances are intrinsically bad" is simply wrong.
This.
That, and plate on all tanks -_-
Rint said:One thing I would like to see changed is for the Dire Lord to be able to wear Plate Armor... Even with all of his really cool health leaching abilities I'm finding it hard to believe he will be as good of a tank as a Warrior or Paladin when all he can wear is Mail, Leather, and Cloth....
Rint
Yes, I mained a Shadow Knight in EQ, and can't get comfortable with the Dire Lord being the only tank unable to wear plate.
Keno Monster said:phil85 said:I played EQ from the start, but I also played Project 1999 more recently. The one thing that eventually ruined Project 1999 for me was the perma camping of raid bosses. This was done mostly by the top guilds, and caused a tremendous amount of training and griefing as well as "poop socking." I hope that Pantheon has some system to avoid this. In EQ, I recall having agreements between guilds to rotate raiding bosses. This seemed to work well. I suppose instances are a last resort option, only because what I experienced in P1999 was so much worse.
Your point is reasonable, but Kunark->Velious on live was 7 months. P1999 spent four years on Kunark before the release of Velious and should never be used to form an opinion of how an MMO should be.
I agree that it's not apples to apples, but these problems arose before Kunark was released and well under a year afterwards. I also felt like the player base in P1999 was younger than many of us former EQ players.
I "hate" the gainer/spender system. It seems clunky and not at all original. It feels like all they've done is change the color and name of the pips you have to build up. I agree with bringing back mana and also I'd like to see more skills be "free" but cooldown based, like flying kick/backstab were in EQ.
Zyellinia said:Grayel said:Zyellinia said:Grayel said:Dynamic scaling of content so that older zones and content remain relevant.
Terrible idea and completely anti-RPG in every way imaginable...
As for what to change, the concept of different but equal at primary role for different classes. There is no way they can balance that along with different non-primary tool-kits even if they manage to get the balance right on the primary role.
Okay, thanks for the feedback...
RPG, role-playing game: assuming the role of a character in a fictional setting, in this case a magical, fantasy fiction.
So please help me understand how dynamic scaling is anti-RPG In every possible way.
example: You run into an area at level 10 and fight goblins, kobolds, orcs or whatever the lowby mob of choice is; the encounters are somewhat challenging. You then power up to level 35 or so, acquiring better skills and gear along the way only to go back to that same area and have the fights still be just as challenging. So how is it in any way RPG consistent that you getting three to four (or more) times stronger doesn't make it easier to beat the same mobs?
Thank you for helping me understand your point of view. I can see where NOT out-leveling content could feel like you aren’t making progress. How the heck can you feel heroic if lower level content remains challenging?
Fair enough concern.
My point is that this allows the game to expand horizontally (expanding older content while retaining challenge), instead of just allowing for vertical expansion (ever upwards and onward with higher level or new content).
Example: devs can add new content, at level, to a zone, that is now fresh and challenging, even to higher level characters without the added concerns of mixing higher and lower level content.
Also, this allows lower level players, friends, guildmates to group up with higher level friends or guildmates and play existing lower level content.
I know nothing in gaming is one-size-fits-all, but I found it enjoyable in games that have done something similar.