Forums » The Dark Myr

Why so many classes

    • 44 posts
    January 13, 2018 6:55 AM PST

    Why are the Dark Myr able to be so many classes compaired to all the other rases in this game... I don't understand why a race that live in the water would be a druid it seem to me that for some reason Dark Myr are almost as able to be any class as the humans. what is it that puts them in the same range as humans and if they are what has stoped the other races from doing the same ??

      

    • 1823 posts
    January 13, 2018 7:56 AM PST

    What's the problem ? It's a race with a balanced culture and body, allowing them to wages war, attune with nature, sneak, follow syronai's precepts or make use of arcane magic. Nothing seems wrong here, and no one cares about classes/races ratios over logic and roleplay.

    Balance should not dictate the possibilities of a race, or you will end up with a wow like pattern.

    • 44 posts
    January 13, 2018 8:43 AM PST

    I am just wounding what in the lore that shows this race can be most classes yet that all the other can not?  Sense all these races came from other worlds where their culture would have already formed, where they would be more likely to fill all the needs of the culture. How can you have a culture where everyone is a War or mages? if all these races would all formed together then I would understand where some would only be what they race were best at.

     I am just thinking with the lore that this world is based on most races would be able to be most classes but not as well as some others would.   

     

    • 1823 posts
    January 13, 2018 9:29 AM PST

    Sorry if I sounded a bit harsh. I was a bit too enticed to my opinion.

     

    I think it all depends of natural or cultural predispositions. For example the ogre are physically huge and strong, favoring battle with a strategic and dominant culture. Why would ogres turn to arcane magic, when they can crush skulls single handed ? Thus magic only comes as an ehancement of natural features, either direct for dire lords, or indirect with shamans and druids. For them i'm more concerned about having both druid and warriors but not ranger (althought I feel the druid a bit out of the landscape for them).

     

    The most obvious opposite beeing gnomes, where natural properties are in defavor of physical strength and their culture favoring arcane science, while showing no interest in spiritual magic.

    Both thoses societies have exploited as much as possible their own physicall advantages, or for gnomes bypassed their weakness by other means.

     

    For more balanced races, humans, dark myrs, elves, physical strength is neither a force to capitalize on, or a weakness you need to bypass. Then comes the choice to do as you wish. For neutral cultures, evil and good are not things favored or avoided, giving them even more choices.

    Dark myr seems evil oriented, but their physical attribute seems balanced around numerous aspects of a society. Arcane, war, religion, attunement to the undersea environment. To me it seems logic they embrace all thoses aspects, because they are not built around a single strength or a culture favoring one or two things.

     

    My 2 copper.

     

    • 655 posts
    January 13, 2018 9:30 AM PST

    I expect we'll see a disproportionate number of Dark Myr on the server at launch.

    1.  It's a new race and people are going to be curious.

    2.  The diversity of class choices means that friends who want to play a specific class will be able to start in the same city.  This is true for humans as well, but minus the novelty factor.

    3.  The sheer math of offering a large number of class choices, given that some percentage of each class will elect to be a specific race.

    • 1823 posts
    January 13, 2018 9:42 AM PST

    Celandor said:

    I expect we'll see a disproportionate number of Dark Myr on the server at launch.

    1.  It's a new race and people are going to be curious.

    2.  The diversity of class choices means that friends who want to play a specific class will be able to start in the same city.  This is true for humans as well, but minus the novelty factor.

    3.  The sheer math of offering a large number of class choices, given that some percentage of each class will elect to be a specific race.

    Probably the most popular evil race, depending of racial feats. Humanlike yet different, high class choices.

    I bet on ogre druids as the least played class/race combo.


    This post was edited by MauvaisOeil at January 13, 2018 9:55 AM PST
    • 619 posts
    January 15, 2018 5:58 AM PST

    It could also have to do with plans to have dark myr not start with legs, and not get them for a long while.

    Thus, they would need access to lots of classes to have their own underwater groups.

    Come to think of it, if their faction list is iksar-like then it makes even more sense for myr to be self sufficient.


    This post was edited by BeaverBiscuit at January 15, 2018 6:01 AM PST
    • 461 posts
    May 1, 2018 8:12 PM PDT

    Dark Elves had a large class choice in EQ as well. Eight total classes to be exact so it's not really out of the ordinary when you think about it. Dark Myr just get an added two classes being Druid and Monk which I can understand Druid but Monk, not so much.

     

    An odd note though i do see is the smallest and largest races have the fewest choices. Then again, after second thought, it makes sense seeing as the physical/mental limitations within certain class choices within those racial archtypes. 

    • 15 posts
    May 20, 2018 8:09 AM PDT
    Dark elf was the god race in eq, dark myr gonna be the god race in pantheon! Hahaha.

    You’ll see me out there with my dark myr dire lord
    • 21 posts
    July 16, 2018 10:57 PM PDT

    Why shouldn't Dark Myr be druids? Are we assuming that the sea is not part of the natural world so wardens of nature have no place there? Who better to have need of the water breathing spells considering their current plight?!

     

    • 136 posts
    July 20, 2018 8:10 PM PDT

    I have only read little of the lore, but I remember that they were able to adapt from originally living underwater to living on land.

    I think it would be fair to assume that the Dark Myr are versatile, and as such, are able to perform in a wide variety of classes.

    • 1714 posts
    November 27, 2018 1:21 PM PST

    MauvaisOeil said:

    What's the problem ? It's a race with a balanced culture and body, allowing them to wages war, attune with nature, sneak, follow syronai's precepts or make use of arcane magic. Nothing seems wrong here, and no one cares about classes/races ratios over logic and roleplay.

    Balance should not dictate the possibilities of a race, or you will end up with a wow like pattern.

    Exactly.


    This post was edited by Syrif at November 27, 2018 1:21 PM PST
    • 246 posts
    December 19, 2018 9:20 AM PST

    BeaverBiscuit said:

    It could also have to do with plans to have dark myr not start with legs, and not get them for a long while.

    Thus, they would need access to lots of classes to have their own underwater groups.

    Come to think of it, if their faction list is iksar-like then it makes even more sense for myr to be self sufficient.

     

    I seem to be the dark myr historian these days :-P

     

     The dark myr come from the seas of a far away world. When they got dumped into the seas of terminus the water was poison to them. Their god gave up her godhood to give the dark myr lungs and legs, and for that they killed her.

     But the dark myr have had lungs & legs and have been living on the land for about 537 years come the start of the game.

    • 329 posts
    October 18, 2019 9:32 AM PDT

    I think it's a couple of reasons. First, Dark Myr are very interesting / popular so they will need a lot of class options  to keep there from being too many Myr in specific classes. Also, and more importantly, Dark Myr are iconic and will be featured heavily in marketing since its one of the things that will help Pantheon stand out.   

    • 926 posts
    October 24, 2019 7:50 AM PDT

    BeaverBiscuit said:

    It could also have to do with plans to have dark myr not start with legs, and not get them for a long while.

    Thus, they would need access to lots of classes to have their own underwater groups.

    Come to think of it, if their faction list is iksar-like then it makes even more sense for myr to be self sufficient.

    This is pretty correct Beaver.  They will definitely be isolated.  The class/race matrix was made before the lore was established so try not to base one on the other (although VR is making some good attempts at designing the lore to make the class/race matrix logical).  Their choices for class/race are based on class population and where they want the highest volumes of people.  Thronefast is their main city, so they want humans to be the most enticing, while like Beaver said, the Dark Myr will likely be isolated from the majority of other races for several months (until teleportation and exploration become more of a priority to other players).  If Dark Myr were allowed to be every class (like the human) then too many people would play Dark Myr because it will be a very popular race. 

    -I would personally play a Dark Myr Paladin and never look back, but now I'm torn between several different race/classes to choose from as my main character... so many so that I'm not sure I'm even going to be able to play just one character (and REALLY enjoy/immerse myself in a single character).   :(


    This post was edited by Darch at October 24, 2019 7:55 AM PDT
    • 1823 posts
    October 24, 2019 2:19 PM PDT

    Darch said:

    BeaverBiscuit said:

    It could also have to do with plans to have dark myr not start with legs, and not get them for a long while.

    Thus, they would need access to lots of classes to have their own underwater groups.

    Come to think of it, if their faction list is iksar-like then it makes even more sense for myr to be self sufficient.

    This is pretty correct Beaver.  They will definitely be isolated.  The class/race matrix was made before the lore was established so try not to base one on the other (although VR is making some good attempts at designing the lore to make the class/race matrix logical).  Their choices for class/race are based on class population and where they want the highest volumes of people.  Thronefast is their main city, so they want humans to be the most enticing, while like Beaver said, the Dark Myr will likely be isolated from the majority of other races for several months (until teleportation and exploration become more of a priority to other players).  If Dark Myr were allowed to be every class (like the human) then too many people would play Dark Myr because it will be a very popular race. 

    -I would personally play a Dark Myr Paladin and never look back, but now I'm torn between several different race/classes to choose from as my main character... so many so that I'm not sure I'm even going to be able to play just one character (and REALLY enjoy/immerse myself in a single character).   :(

     

    Please stop spreading your self-made opinion as a truth on this specific subject.

     

    Race class matrix has been done because of reasons.

     

    You think it's to manage class populations, which is fine.

     

     

    I think they simply had raw design of races before etablishing a strict lore and picked out of it what fitted that raw idea. Refining the idea don't mean you go against the raw idea of the race, background and feel you want it to express, that's pretty much like writing or making a tabletop RPG character : Because you deepen the background and history doesn't invalidate your initial idea.

    • 926 posts
    December 5, 2019 10:56 AM PST

    MauvaisOeil said:

    Please stop spreading your self-made opinion as a truth on this specific subject.

    Race class matrix has been done because of reasons.

     

    You think it's to manage class populations, which is fine.

    I think they simply had raw design of races before etablishing a strict lore and picked out of it what fitted that raw idea. Refining the idea don't mean you go against the raw idea of the race, background and feel you want it to express, that's pretty much like writing or making a tabletop RPG character : Because you deepen the background and history doesn't invalidate your initial idea.

    Please stop spreading your self-made opinion as a truth on this specific subject.

    • 1823 posts
    December 5, 2019 11:00 AM PST

    Darch said:

    MauvaisOeil said:

     ...

    You think...

    I think...

    Please stop spreading your self-made opinion as a truth on this specific subject.

    Well try a bit harder next time.


    This post was edited by MauvaisOeil at December 5, 2019 11:01 AM PST
    • 926 posts
    December 6, 2019 5:26 AM PST

    MauvaisOeil said:

     

    I think they simply had raw design of races before etablishing a strict lore and picked out of it what fitted that raw idea. Refining the idea don't mean you go against the raw idea of the race, background and feel you want it to express, that's pretty much like writing or making a tabletop RPG character : Because you deepen the background and history doesn't invalidate your initial idea.

    This is your opinion @Mauv, being expressed as a truth.  I would say that changing the background of an RPG character would absolutely change the validation (for or against) your initial idea - and often times can often change a player's mind in their character's creation.  

     

    • 383 posts
    December 6, 2019 6:23 AM PST

    Why dont you bold the sentence that began "I think"? Isnt the first sentence in a paragraph connected to the rest of that paragraph?...... Is it because your entire argument hinges on omitting it? Is it really worth twisting your own brain into mush (lying to self/omitting information) in order to feel like you have a valid argument? Are you aware you omitted information or did you accidently do that? Powerful questions.

     

    The man said he thinks.... Thats stating an opinion. He simply asked you to aknowledge the same, which you reluctantly did (without admitting it). Your blood is upon his steel.

    • 1823 posts
    December 6, 2019 11:41 AM PST

    That's cool. I'm used to some bouncing back and forth with Darch and I doubt his opinion doesn't get downgraded because the way he express it. I've stated my belief on the situation, now the only true reasons are in VR's hand and their own choices, neither in mine, neither in Darch's.

    • 2740 posts
    December 6, 2019 1:17 PM PST

    The class/race matrix was made after the game and racial lore, not the other way around. They aren't justifying the matrix by making up lore to fit it, it's the other way around. 

    • 926 posts
    December 10, 2019 7:05 AM PST

    Alyonyah said:

    Why dont you bold the sentence that began "I think"? Isnt the first sentence in a paragraph connected to the rest of that paragraph?...... Is it because your entire argument hinges on omitting it? Is it really worth twisting your own brain into mush (lying to self/omitting information) in order to feel like you have a valid argument? Are you aware you omitted information or did you accidently do that? Powerful questions.

     

    The man said he thinks.... Thats stating an opinion. He simply asked you to aknowledge the same, which you reluctantly did (without admitting it). Your blood is upon his steel.

     

    The point I made was the same as the one Mauv made Alyonyah.  He picked one point of my statement and declared my entire post was a declaration of fact instead of my opinion.  Mauv, Iksar and a few others constantly have back and forths - but we also agree on a lot.  its what we do :p

    Iksar said:

    The class/race matrix was made after the game and racial lore, not the other way around. They aren't justifying the matrix by making up lore to fit it, it's the other way around. 

    This is "partially" incorrect @Iksar, they are just barely finishing the lore... the current race/class matrix has been set for at least 3 years now.  The true part of your statement is that they aren't neccassarily justifying the matrix by "making up lore to fit it" as much as they are just making great lore.  I've said it many many times before, you can't use the lore to justify the class/race matrix because it is absolutely irrelevant and nonesensical because you can use the lore for AND against a reason a class should or shouldn't be a certain race.  Their race/class matrix is based on balance and forcing people to make difficult decisions... not the lore.


    This post was edited by Darch at December 10, 2019 7:15 AM PST
    • 926 posts
    December 10, 2019 7:05 AM PST

    Double Post


    This post was edited by Darch at December 10, 2019 7:06 AM PST
    • 383 posts
    December 10, 2019 7:44 AM PST

    Darch said:

     

    The point I made was the same as the one Mauv made Alyonyah.  He picked one point of my statement and declared my entire post was a declaration of fact instead of my opinion.  Mauv, Iksar and a few others constantly have back and forths - but we also agree on a lot.  its what we do :p

     

     

    I understand this its just obvious we could be doing ALOT better communicating, by aknowledging when we are wrong (or atleast considering it before reacting) and not pretending its normal to talk to each other like politicians. Especially with our friends. Youd be shocked how many people dont even post on these forums because of attacks from certain members in the community. Some people have never "thrown elbows" so to speak, and its completely foreign and frightening to them. I understand they need to toughen up a bit, but it would also help for some of us to soften our stances. Do you not see any wisdom in these words?

     

    That said mauv and darch I respect both of you guys. I see your words and I know they are the words of people who care about what happens here. Im just asking the community that truly cares to level up together. Lets experience something new, and leave those old ways behind. Sword into the wind!