Forums » The Wizard

Burst Vs Sustained DPS - Options

    • 12 posts
    May 2, 2018 5:09 AM PDT

    Re: Mana Regen - I had a chance to try a wizard at PAX East. They seem to be building in abilities (in the Arcane line) that use less mana and have a mana regen component within them. The goal appeared to be to switch to these abilities when your mana was low to help regen faster.

    • 348 posts
    May 13, 2018 9:40 PM PDT

    Kecho said:

    Camping groups need wizzards in my opinion.  Reason for this is AOE!!  Kill mobs quicker means more loot and more xp.   I actually like High Outputs, but make sure the cool downs are set right.  If you play a wizzard you want to see the BOOM.  Like a Rogue wants to see high numbers on backstab.  It's why you play the class, but with that comes discipline.  You boom to fast and well your taking a sand nap or getting up close and personable with the tile on the floor.  I believe in Games to many people want to sit and just continuely cast on mobs in dungeons.  if you go back to old school, then how many times where the casters casting one spell and then sitting?  This happened alot in Dungeon camps because you had to conserve your mana for that one pull that was coming.  So you didn't continuely cast or you would be OOM.  A good Caster knows not to use all the mana on one mob and then sit, you need to conserve use it when you have to.  When the mob turns and starts running, Kill it NOW!!  The other thing to remember is that you can use the lower level spells at high levels.  They will do less damange, but you wont' be taking dirt naps.  It's tactics know when to use your spells, not just sit there and hit your big boom spells.

    Most definitely, other things depending on the game economy, I used to make a living teleporting people for donations and runes, I was the server UBER back ith the day :)

    • 1901 posts
    May 14, 2018 2:13 AM PDT

    If you played eq1, you would know AOE wasn't really a thing in exp groups .

    • 2010 posts
    May 14, 2018 7:00 AM PDT

    MauvaisOeil said:

    If you played eq1, you would know AOE wasn't really a thing in exp groups .

    Not very often I guess compared to standard groups, but to say aoe groups wasn't a thing seems like a misrepresentation.  Once Luclin came out it became much more common.  Even pugs were running aoe groups in fungus grove.  Slightly better geared players would aoe the grey.  It did require 2 decent enchanters of course and a specific group makeup but it was a much faster way to gain exp than normal groups.

    Edit: oh, I think I misinterpreted what you said.  You mean people didnt use aoe in standard groups? I think right?  because aoe would break whatever type of CC was being used, and it was better to focus fire on one mob. Pretty sure thats what you meant and you are, of course, correct.  Disregard the above.


    This post was edited by philo at May 14, 2018 7:04 AM PDT
    • 4534 posts
    May 14, 2018 12:56 PM PDT

    philo said:

    MauvaisOeil said:

    If you played eq1, you would know AOE wasn't really a thing in exp groups .

    Not very often I guess compared to standard groups, but to say aoe groups wasn't a thing seems like a misrepresentation.  Once Luclin came out it became much more common.  Even pugs were running aoe groups in fungus grove.  Slightly better geared players would aoe the grey.  It did require 2 decent enchanters of course and a specific group makeup but it was a much faster way to gain exp than normal groups.

    Edit: oh, I think I misinterpreted what you said.  You mean people didnt use aoe in standard groups? I think right?  because aoe would break whatever type of CC was being used, and it was better to focus fire on one mob. Pretty sure thats what you meant and you are, of course, correct.  Disregard the above.

    I think both are kind of true. AOE wasn't really a thing in most groups. But you could indeed have a dedicated AOE group and be quite productive with it. So that could also be considered an "exp group."

    • 1901 posts
    May 14, 2018 3:02 PM PDT

    I agree AOE was used in some era, including luclins (especially with quadding from wiz and druids), but it was far to be "common", because even if they were effective in dps and dpm, AOE threat wasn't a thing except for some really odd compositions (like bard AOE mez to grab threat, but you would need an overgeared bard to take the hits).

    I'm more refering to "classic era", where as very few classes had effective spammable AOE types, it was less effective and more mana efficient to focus on killing target after target.

    • 2 posts
    June 16, 2018 5:52 AM PDT

    Regardless of burst or sustained, the casting feel for a Wizard must feel BOOMY.  EQ did this fairly well but utterly failed in EQ2.  All the combat for Wiz in EQ2 felt like i was playing an old school bard; never ending key mashing whack a mole with spells that felt limp and useless without even the utility that a Bard would bring for CC.

    • 85 posts
    June 16, 2018 7:58 AM PDT

    zapthosmobbs said:

    Regardless of burst or sustained, the casting feel for a Wizard must feel BOOMY.  EQ did this fairly well but utterly failed in EQ2.  All the combat for Wiz in EQ2 felt like i was playing an old school bard; never ending key mashing whack a mole with spells that felt limp and useless without even the utility that a Bard would bring for CC.

     

    Totally agree with you regarding EQ2. I popped back last week and made a wizard just for kicks and your right the class has no punch to it.

    Old school EQ1 Wizards felt powerful. Ice Comet? Do you remember getting this spell? It dominated for many levels. Even the AoE stuff felt 'punchy'. 

    In my opinion Wizards should get the highest DD single cast spell in the game, plus a great deal of utility; levitate, invis, port, escape etc. I remember once getting slightly drunk and porting my regular group to Cazic Thule for a laugh, I can still hear the screams, those were the days.

    Blood.

    • 150 posts
    June 18, 2018 3:17 PM PDT

    Iksar said:

    I'd prefer it to be in the hands of the player by making use of the living codex to tailor their spells to how they want to play. If you want to make your spells massive damage but with long cast time/cooldown/or high mana cost then it should be an option, and it should be just as efficient as throwing out however many fast casting low damage spells that can be cast in the same time. 

     

     

    I really like this idea. In your spell book under the spell you could have a slider. Instead of 200 different spells let us change the spells we do have. Slider goes all the way to the right that means it's in burst mode. Slider all the way to the left means its sustainable dps mode. The further to the right it is the longer it takes to cast and the more mana it consumes. And of course as you guessed it the further left it is the less mana and faster casting it is.

    I liked being a glass cannon. I like being able to lay the smack down when needed. Cleric is short on mana and having a hard time keeping the tank alive, it's nice when Mr. Wizard can come in and regulate. But it was never fun sitting through a mob or two trying to regen enough mana to be useful again. In EQ if pulls came in fast Wizards were panting and had no mana to be useful. I definitely see the need to fine tune things and make sure that the class is balanced. The hard part is not making them OP because of tweaking them to make them a little better at sustaining DPS.

     

    I don't want to be relegated to solo kiting single or quad pulls all the time. Being useful in a group is very important.

    • 34 posts
    August 16, 2018 2:59 AM PDT

    A quick post to acknowledge that the recent wizard class mechanics reveal has, in my mind, addressed the concerns I expressed in the original post.

    I am excited for Alpha!

    • 424 posts
    November 16, 2018 1:43 PM PST
    Great ideas here. Im also more of a fan of dropping occassional bombs and seeing large portions of hp drop off, as Iksar said.

    I love Hokanu's suggestion off of Skycaster's:
    "Thats a cool idea with the ability to change the damage / mana / cast time of a spell on the fly.. maybe this could be as simple as pressing the spell again during the cast time to end the spell and drop the bomb at that point with the reduced mana cost and damage."

    This is brilliant, and could give another dimension of activity and control to wizards befitting their lore. And it could provide, so easily, the awesome experience of a wizard allowing a spell to run fully, with a long cast time, sustaining concentration, with a large effect. That's such an excellent fantasy image thatd be really enjoyed in Pantheon.

    I guess letting a spell run its course could end up being the most efficient strategy - but perhaps not.