Forums » The Rogue

Why would anyone be a Rugue

    • 332 posts
    November 14, 2016 8:23 AM PST

    Hello everyone. As the heading states I need some reasons to be a Rogue. Recently on project 1999 I decided to roll a Dark elf Rogue. Upon starting I found myself in a city that I have never visited. I learned my way around and proceeded to level. At level 4 i decided to journey to e commons and join the rest of the newbies and level up. That was a disaster. My high level druid made me some leather armour and I thought I was in good standing there. I went to freeport to bind and since the guards were only dubious I proceeded to the bank to deposit my plat i recieved from my "sponser". BAD MOVE. Seems that north freeport guards don't love me as much. Also none of the merchants like me either. After my cr i went back to the tunnel and. The only one who would sell to me was that shifty pirate.

    So I decided to scrap him and make a half elf Rogue. Started in freeport and went to my trainer. Had a hard time finding him but after 2 deaths from Boomba or Punta  or whoever I found him. when i left the trainer I took a wrong turn,so I decided to look around. BAD MOVE. Death was waiting for me from some Darky in a room i tried to enter. Luckily I did not put on any of my new clother I took from my D E  Rogue. So I went outside and sat to ponder the question.

    WHY WOULD ANYONE WANT TO BE A ROGUE.

    I really want to try out the Rogue in Pantheon. But if they are as disliked I need a few reasons to try her. After you all stop laughing and can type again please enlighten me. I am a true Druid at heart and really would like to try the Rogue.

    Thanks

    • 216 posts
    November 14, 2016 10:57 AM PST

    You sir/ma'am ran into a racial issue more than a rogue class issue and one I desperately missed in later phases of EQ where race didn't matter.

    I did enjoy the chuckle tho :D

    • 4513 posts
    November 14, 2016 11:41 AM PST

    Warben said:

    You sir/ma'am ran into a racial issue more than a rogue class issue and one I desperately missed in later phases of EQ where race didn't matter.

    I did enjoy the chuckle tho :D

    Yeah only your race & deity affect how people view you in EQ. I am glad Pantheon will have similar faction systems. In some ways, it makes sense that people would not think highly of Rogue, unless they are also a scoundrel. But on the other hand, it's kinda unrealistic, in most cases, that you'd be able to tell what "profession" someone is or even what deity they worship just by looking at them. Race is only way to immediately tell if someone is likely to be an enemy or not, as racist as that sounds lol. And even still, an enchanter can easily deceive the eye with their illusions. In Skyrim, the guards won't view a Rogue as a target unless they have actually been caught in the act of stealing something. Because in that case, regardless of what race you are - even if you are the same race as the guards - you're now the enemy. I would love for Pantheon to have a crime/bounty system like that. I think that's the best and most realistic approach.

    Don't give up, Rogues are fun - just ask Kilsin :)

    • 196 posts
    December 2, 2016 1:20 PM PST

    IMO::: There is no better class to play...................You are a person of many faces (coat of many colors so to speak) You get to run around and be a sneaky as you want ,pick pockets and if someone pisses you off.....stab them in the back ! You get all the ass you want (more than a toilet seat) If you know how to play one,it dont matter your race (always escape .like the cowards we are when there is trouble)You make poisons ,use them on anyone  if you wish.You can play with any (bodies)(perv) when called upon .Factions,well  you know there are always a way around that.Rogues have always been my fav,so much you can do.

    • 77 posts
    December 3, 2016 2:08 AM PST

    my favorite was coming to a merchant that would sell to me...ok then...i can get around that (sneak) and get behind merchant..oh look you will sell to me now. i always liked to think i held a knife to his throat as i did business with him LOL. it worked with everything. banking? no problem! just really needed to watch out for LoS guards. 

    • 196 posts
    December 3, 2016 1:03 PM PST

     float over them or walk on the roof tops or just run your ass off (tie your shoes) and scream.......................train !!!!

    • 4513 posts
    December 5, 2016 11:41 AM PST

    Alix said:

    You get all the ass you want (more than a toilet seat)

    How can you be so sure? lol

    • 196 posts
    December 6, 2016 8:39 PM PST

    Hell if I know...............It just sounded good *wink*

    • 79 posts
    December 7, 2016 3:36 AM PST

    From what I've seen in games like EQ and Vanguard the rogue excels at doing a lot of damage very quickly; the backstab. They're similar to a wizard as to not getting yourself killed by doing too much damage too quickly and creating aggro. 

    So IMO, play a rogue if you like being a glass cannon that can sneak/scout. Most groups would like to have a rogue in it's ranks.

     

    As far as the RP aspects go, a rogue is hated equally by most civilized communities. They're down with the dirty deeds so you would expect most guards/NPCs to be dubious or KoS. Some people like that challenge but I can see how that would get annoying if you're just into playing the game and not RP.

    • 12 posts
    December 7, 2016 10:12 PM PST

    Haha, in EQ it's REALLY hard to play a rogue as your only dedicated char.  Rogues had a ROUGH upbringing in EQ, easily being the most broken and weakest class in Classic EQ.  That all changed in Kunark, but it's imperative to make an easier class, like a caster, farm the gear for the rogue and twink him out.  WAY more fun that way ;)

    • 18 posts
    December 9, 2016 7:30 PM PST

    Bazgrim said:

    Alix said:

    You get all the ass you want (more than a toilet seat)

    How can you be so sure? lol

    Because everybody knows rogues do it from behind of course !


    This post was edited by Krissvalnor at December 9, 2016 7:30 PM PST
    • 196 posts
    December 10, 2016 11:30 AM PST

    Yes ! thats it !

    • 141 posts
    March 31, 2017 12:32 PM PDT

    This isn't Everquest, nor is this P99. That said, my rogue is awesome. I can sneak and hide anywhere, pick locks, do insane dps and generally be wanted in groups. Also, I can travel easily, evil race or not.

     

    In EQ, everything is hard early on. Gear negates that as time goes on. Then the game becomes trivial and easy.

    • 35 posts
    April 29, 2019 12:59 AM PDT

    The reason someone would want to be a rogue is because in all of those crappy situations you found yourself in, a rogue wouldn't be in them, at least not a good rogue :P
    Every other class short of an enchanter that can disguise him/herself will ALWAYS have to deal with those NPCs killing them. A rogue would just sneak right passed them all, maybe pickpocketting someone on the way.

    • 41 posts
    May 23, 2019 7:52 AM PDT

    The polls show the Rogue and Monk have the lowers numbers.  I think if I was to play a Rogue, it would solely be to offset their low numbers.  

    • 21 posts
    June 3, 2019 4:36 PM PDT

    A well-geared rogue played correctly can dish out the most dps in a fight. That's pretty rewarding if topping the damage charts is your groove.

    • 1057 posts
    June 4, 2019 4:28 PM PDT

    If you think being a half elf rogue was bad, try being a necro or shadowknight - nobody likes Innorruuk or Cazic Thule LMAO  :p

     

    • 127 posts
    July 10, 2019 5:19 PM PDT

    Because rogue, so far, would be the best dedicated melee DPS in Pantheon.

    • 107 posts
    February 17, 2021 11:07 AM PST

    An Enchanter was always going to be my main, with the Rogue being an alt. However, the more I think about the nightmare of charms breaking (I really don't think I have the patience for that anymore), and groups only ever wanting you for that purpose, the Rogue is fast becoming the desired class to play as my main.

    Following the recent dev stream on crafting, it seems that, depending on how sneak / stealth is implemented, a Rogue could potentially be a good class to harvest crafting materials in areas that are usually difficult to get to. If that's the case, then I'd add that as another reason why you'd play the class, other than the obvious reasons, such as DPS / utility.

    • 1057 posts
    March 3, 2021 7:46 AM PST

    Shadowbound said:

    An Enchanter was always going to be my main, with the Rogue being an alt. However, the more I think about the nightmare of charms breaking (I really don't think I have the patience for that anymore), and groups only ever wanting you for that purpose, the Rogue is fast becoming the desired class to play as my main.

    Following the recent dev stream on crafting, it seems that, depending on how sneak / stealth is implemented, a Rogue could potentially be a good class to harvest crafting materials in areas that are usually difficult to get to. If that's the case, then I'd add that as another reason why you'd play the class, other than the obvious reasons, such as DPS / utility.

    I agree 100% with this Shadowbound.  Rogue has traditionally been my least favorite class to play in an MMO, but it is looking like the most appealing class in PRotF.  They've put so much into this class that it is likely going to be an overpopulated class.  It has a lot of pros with very little stress and likely one of the highest DPS.  Stealth + CC + high DPS + vanish if about to die + high desirability in groups + no stress of tanking/healing = going to be very popular.  It's like the pros of being a caster (safe from damage/high damage/utility) with the pros of being a melee (cool looking weapon/armor and funner combat) without the cons each typically have (casters are usually squishy and melee usually have to eat deaths when the sh*t hits the fan).   

    Perma-stealth (invis) is an incredibly powerful tool; If other classes don't have the ability to remove the risk of being detected by enemies when all they want to do is maybe explore the beautiful environment or harvest in peace, we can expect the Rogue to be the overly popular choice of the melee DPS.

    • 121 posts
    March 5, 2021 2:22 PM PST

    I want all classes in Pantheon to be good, and have their one of two things no other class has.

    But from what I've seen tbe Rogue as designed is already too over-powered, and I hope by release it gets hit with a nerf hammer and fairly hard.

    Take a class that fights from the back, has invisibility, the supposedly highest DPS in melee (note we have not seen warrior, paladin, ranger or monk yet) give them the ability to pick locks and you've already got an OP character.

    So they give them crowd control too, the ability to use poison, cantrip, specialized climbing etc.

    I've always thought rogue the cowardly class in any MMO, they hide with invis or smoke and then backstab. So I've never understood why people would want to play like that in a herioic game, but so be it.  But if they are the lock pickers, the poisoners AND the highest DPS, they should not have any CC ...at all...imho. NOR should they be the higherst DPS in game with a puny dagger.  Makes zero logical sense.

     

     

     


    This post was edited by Nagasakee at March 6, 2021 4:31 AM PST
    • 127 posts
    March 15, 2021 2:08 PM PDT

    Only want to play a Rouge but it's not in the class list apparently :(

    • 127 posts
    March 15, 2021 2:15 PM PDT

    Nagasakee said:

    But if they are the lock pickers, the poisoners AND the highest DPS, they should not have any CC ...at all...imho. NOR should they be the higherst DPS in game with a puny dagger.  Makes zero logical sense.

     

    That's how I feel about monks.
    Monks weren't unarmed martial artists in the western medieval, they were scribes and scholars. The only Warrior Monks were Templars, and they had similar equipment as Knights. They weren't naked barefist fighter.

    So when I see a monk fighting barefist a Dragon/Demon and doing more damage than a Warrior, always makes me cringe.
    To me Monk are so out of place I just hate that class.

    And same as you, the idea of the rogue, I don't really like it. I prefer to think of it as an Assassin instead. I think it reflects better the speciality to have someone fighting in his own term and having precise and lethal blows. Rogue is an unappealing name to me.


    This post was edited by Khraag at March 15, 2021 2:18 PM PDT
    • 1057 posts
    March 21, 2021 3:09 PM PDT

    Khraag said:

    Nagasakee said:

    But if they are the lock pickers, the poisoners AND the highest DPS, they should not have any CC ...at all...imho. NOR should they be the higherst DPS in game with a puny dagger.  Makes zero logical sense.

     

    That's how I feel about monks.
    Monks weren't unarmed martial artists in the western medieval, they were scribes and scholars. The only Warrior Monks were Templars, and they had similar equipment as Knights. They weren't naked barefist fighter.

    So when I see a monk fighting barefist a Dragon/Demon and doing more damage than a Warrior, always makes me cringe.
    To me Monk are so out of place I just hate that class.

    And same as you, the idea of the rogue, I don't really like it. I prefer to think of it as an Assassin instead. I think it reflects better the speciality to have someone fighting in his own term and having precise and lethal blows. Rogue is an unappealing name to me.

    This is how I feel about Bards too...  Dual weilding, plate armor wearing, melee combatant... huh?  :(

    • 121 posts
    March 23, 2021 4:23 AM PDT

    Khraag said:

    [

    That's how I feel about monks.
    Monks weren't unarmed martial artists in the western medieval, they were scribes and scholars. The only Warrior Monks were Templars, and they had similar equipment as Knights. They weren't naked barefist fighter.

    So when I see a monk fighting barefist a Dragon/Demon and doing more damage than a Warrior, always makes me cringe.
    To me Monk are so out of place I just hate that class.

     

    I agree with all you've said here, surprisingly perhaps.  I would mention that the Western warrior monks you mention, of Britain, France, Germany, ...the Knights Templar, were perhaps the most feared warriors of the western world, surpassed only by the Berserker Vikings of Scandinavia. So even in the western world monks were ferocious fighters.

    But the monk class is NOT historically based upon the WESTERN world of Europe, it was based upon the D&D Island of Wu in the Orient, and of course by extension Japan and China.  The idea of a Monk class kind of "originated"* in Dungeon's and Dragons with the 2 manuals entitled "Oriental Adventures" in 1985.  So EASTERN monks have been part of the overall lore of EQ, EQ2, Vanguard, Pantheon and many others for 36 years now.  

    When you think Monks, think more of Bruce Lee, IP Man, Shaing Chi (his movie comes out fairly soon), Black Panther, Iron Fist etc rather than an English scribe making a Bible.   They are mystic fighters harnessing the power of Chi or Ki to make themselves the finest warriors that exist. They are agility/dexterity fighters in most games, dependent upon active avoidance rather than heavy passive armor to stay alive.If you want a great literary example read the 9 books of the Thomas Covvenant Chronicles and focus upon the undying Monk warriors, the Haruchai, or The Bloodguard.  

    I do agree that  it stretches the imagination of a Monk punching a Dragon to death, or even punching through plate mail.  But this is a fantasy game, and all class muct be able to contribute to all fights vs mobs, right?

    Glad you agree on the Rogue, hope it gets fixed before launch.   And yes Bards are OP too :)

     

    * I am well aware that other games had a monk class before D&D and AD&D, just using this as an easy to understand historical starting point for the lore in Pantheon


    This post was edited by Nagasakee at March 23, 2021 4:26 AM PDT