Forums » Pantheon Classes

Backstab & Waylay

    • 612 posts
    June 16, 2023 7:54 PM PDT

    Why do both of these abilities exist?

    Yes I understand the Flavour reasoning as Stab implies a Pokie weapon and as such using a Slashing or Bashing weapon doesn't work well with the name Backstab... but for all intents and purposes this just creates an un-needed double ability simply because MMO players are quite attached to the name 'Backstab' as a Rogue ability.

    As it sits right now, both Backstab and Waylay are exactly the same ability. They have the exact the same Tooltips other than the 'Requires piercing' or 'Requires Slash or Blunt' weapons. They have the same Cooldown  They have exactly the same Mastery and are gained at exactly the same level. They even both use Strength as their Modifying attribute.

    Since they are exactly the same attack with just a different name, it just seems like just a waste of players time. It just creates bother. Instead of just having 1 ability that is the obligatory 'Hit from Behind' attack usable by any weapon, we instead have 2 abilities that are the same and force Rogues to just swap the Icon on their Hotbar every time they swap weapon types. Plus it forces Rogues to spend double Mastery Points just so they can use the exact same ability with multiple weapon types.

    Perhaps they could simply make 1 ability and just call it 'Backstab / Waylay' and just make the Icon look different when you swap weapon types. Or don't we have the Technology for that?

    I think if you are going to go to the whole trouble of having 2 abilities, they could at least act differently. They should have unique effects even if they do similar damage. For one they could each cause a different state in the target; Like Backstab could cause Vulnerable and Waylay could cause Dazed. Secondly they could have them do secondary effects like Backstab gives a debuff that increases bleed effects by 10% for 10 seconds. While Waylay could reduce resistance to Charm and Mezmerize effects by 10% for 10 seconds. Or maybe they could make them take advantage of different states. Maybe Backstab does more damage to Bleeding targets, while Waylay does more damage to Stunned targets.

    Maybe I'm just being petty, but I just see the current double up of the same ability as just causing negatives simply because Rogue players get ornery if they don't have a backstab ability and ornery again if you tell them they can backstab with a mace.

    Prove me wrong! *wink*

    • 2126 posts
    June 17, 2023 5:27 PM PDT

    I really agree with all of this.

    • 1479 posts
    June 19, 2023 2:08 PM PDT

    I do feel having them mirrored is a placeholder to make sure they are equally balanced before delving into something else.

    I'd love have waylay use both weapons to achieve similar damage, but that would also mean backstab remain stronger until you have two equally good weapons, in which case it is barely "as good as".


    Imho waylay could just strike twice with half the damage to make it a bit different, but avoid having it either inferior or superior.

    • 295 posts
    June 19, 2023 8:17 PM PDT

    It's already been stated that as they increase in level they will become more distinctive and have different effects...or something similiar to that.