I get that this is a kind of open-ended question, but I'm kind of curious how broad the term goes and if all the races had a pantheon.
For example, the Dark Myr specifically mention and revolve around their goddess who saved them. On the other end of the spectrum, Gnomes seem to have had elders, but no god(s) or goddess(es) to speak of. The closest thing to a diety they seem to have had was Elos, the star at the center of their Dyson Sphere in what might have been a more secular religion of some sort, if they even had one at all. On the other hand, some races seem to not have had what we'd consider a rigid or organized religion to their gods, instead worshiping nature or the spirits in a more general sense. These types of things can include such entities as Loa or Kami, which are not EXACTLY gods in the normal Abrahamic or polytheistic sense, but have a measure of power and the divine to the cultures that revere them. Witch Doctors and Shamanistic cultures would chiefly fall under this banner.
Presumably every race on Terminus had SOME kind of a pantheon - it's in the game's name, after all! - else how would they have gotten to Terminus? The Gnomes may be the one odd one out here, since they came in what might ammount to a starship...but it's hard to be sure. Would be pretty wild if Elos ended up having a spirit and an echo/shard of it ended up residing in the Resivor pillar and hitching a ride to Terminus as the Gnomes resident god/dess, including opening up the way when the Gnomes made what might have ammounted to a blind hyperspace jump to get there - perhaps the destination was not so random if it was guided by the hand of a goddess...
Anyway, that's kind of an aside. The question is more generally "what kinds of things do the races of Pantheon consider divine/holy/gods"?
Each race has their own Pantheon, even the gnome have a unique relationship to their Pantheon (though we know nothing more than that). The halfling appear to worship sort of demi-god entities (the Wards of Hiryth) but otherwise seem to not have any connection to the actual god(s) from their home world. I am sure more on that will be revealed in time though.
Hm...yeah, the Halflings seemed to have sentient Wards (though this could mean...a lot of things, as a ward can be a person/entity as well as a spell or barrier), and the Gnomes seemed to have reverence for their star bordering on a religious view, at least so far as a secular society HAS a religious view.
But some of the race pages specifically talk about their gods while others...don't really delve into the topic.
Based on the stuff about the Veil and the Pantheons interacting, it would stand to reason that they all DID have gods - or, at least, there were gods or god-like beings from all of their worlds. Though maybe I'm misunderstanding that and the compact that was formed.
It has always been my assumption that since the name of the game is "Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen" that the basic storyline of the game would be the Rising of these Fallen Pantheons here on the planet of Terminus. Each race that the players can choose, and even maybe some that the Players cannot choose (yet?), all have different Pantheons of Deities. Each of these Pantheons have 'fallen' in some way and become less powerful or lost or forgotten. Thus my guess that the storylines of the game will be the re-emergance or 'Rise' of these fallen Pantheons back to some sort of glory or at least promenence within their cultures. As us Players adventure, we will slowly unlock these storylines and be part of the re-emergance of these Pantheons and their Rise.
At least for this first edition of the game. Perhaps if/when we get to an expansion it will be about something different, but for now I would guess that the main story arch of the game will be these Pantheons and their Rise.
This is of course why Joppa and other Dev's always shy away from questions about if players will be interacting or fighting with 'Gods'. They don't want to spoil any of the story.
Well, I think the pantheons WERE here. The Cleric page talks about the gods retreating to behind the Veil. I don't remember the lore story that said all this, but basically, Terminus is kind of a Traverse Town (Kingdom Hearts 1 reference) where people(s) kind of just...end up...in the case of KH1, when their worlds were destroyed, but in Pantheon, we don't know what caused it. But in the distant past, the gods were on Terminus. We know this from several stories. The Dark Myr are one example, where their goddess came with them to Terminus, saw that the waters here were toxic to them and killing them, and so quickly made the decision to sacrifice herself/her body to change them into a form where they COULD survive. In the case of the Dwarves, their god literally lives among them as a demi-god who may still be very very powerful, but who gave up his immortality to shield them.
There was also some massive war with dragons and chaos and insanity - seriously, the shizzle went DOWN - that ended with some kind of major truce/agreement/covenant. Part of this covenant seems to be that the gods were no longer allowed to interact directly with Terminus, and had to withdraw to the opposite side of some kind of anti-god barrier, called the Veil. This resulted in the war ending, and...I THINK...basically all of the dragons going into hiding, with most of them outright vanishing without a trace, clutch and brood and nests and dens all empty, with but a few survivors remaining in very secluded places, keeping their secrets and not sharing what they know of what happened - perhaps not even knowing THEMSELVES and still trying to figure it out.
I think the Keepings of Castigue mentioned some of this in a very light way - mainly, the encounter with the dragon - but I don't remember where I read the rest of it, just that it was a while ago. Well, parts are from the race pages (Dwarves, Dark Myr, etc), and the Cleric page, of course...
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EDIT: Oh, and I'm sure it's NOT true...but I once had a theory that was probably too sciency/sci-fi. Basically, entropy happens, and leads to the heat death of the universe, but the gods got together and decided that MAYBE they could make a LIITTTTTLE pocket world that could survive. Entropy happens, but it's conservation of entropy. So if you increse the entropy outside of the Veil, then it could cause a decrease of entropy (conservation) inside, resulting in a localized increase of order. In effect, you could make a pocket universe, let the outside go to heat death at an accelerated rate, which would extend the life of the pocket universe to effectively infinity.
...but this is because I'm a science nerd.
And before you say it: Entropy is weird. It increases for every process IN THE SYSTEM AS A WHOLE, but this allows for localized decreases in entropy. It's not STRICTLY conserved, because it always increases, but there is a weird conservation at play that scientists have figured out can be worked with at some scales. By forcing entropy to increase in part of a system, you can cause a localized decrease in a weird quazi-conservation that we don't fully understand, but we know observationally does, indeed work.
Renathras said:
And before you say it: Entropy is weird. It increases for every process IN THE SYSTEM AS A WHOLE, but this allows for localized decreases in entropy. It's not STRICTLY conserved, because it always increases, but there is a weird conservation at play that scientists have figured out can be worked with at some scales. By forcing entropy to increase in part of a system, you can cause a localized decrease in a weird quazi-conservation that we don't fully understand, but we know observationally does, indeed work.
Well, duh! Doesn't that go without saying? :)
Gyldervane said:Well, duh! Doesn't that go without saying? :)
Renathras said:[...]
EDIT: Oh, and I'm sure it's NOT true...but I once had a theory that was probably too sciency/sci-fi. Basically, entropy happens, and leads to the heat death of the universe, but the gods got together and decided that MAYBE they could make a LIITTTTTLE pocket world that could survive. Entropy happens, but it's conservation of entropy. So if you increse the entropy outside of the Veil, then it could cause a decrease of entropy (conservation) inside, resulting in a localized increase of order. In effect, you could make a pocket universe,let the outside go to heat death at an accelerated rate, (but that takes some millenium to do, universally speaking, right?)
which would extend the life of the pocket universe(Terminus?) to effectively infinity.
...but this is because I'm a science nerd.
And before you say it: Entropy is weird. It increases for every process IN THE SYSTEM AS A WHOLE, but this allows for localized decreases in entropy. It's not STRICTLY conserved, because it always increases, but there is a weird conservation at play that scientists have figured out can be worked with at some scales. By forcing entropy to increase in part of a system, you can cause a localized decrease in a weird quazi-conservation that we don't fully understand, but we know observationally does, indeed work.
So, imagining this from an expansion(s) perspective, this could mean, a zone/transfer/gate into the Veil - "Keepers of the Veil!" expansion with new monster designs and some dragons perhaps, leading to hints where dragons are in terminus who have been hidden. Also, an expansion where the home world now somewhat parched and destroyed from the piece taken out that the natives will be eager to swarm into terminus should they find out its existence?
Renathras said:Gyldervane said:Well, duh! Doesn't that go without saying? :)
Not exactly. That it increases in every reaction (rather than it remaining equal) would seem to indicate there is NOT any kind of conservation at play. The fact we cannot even construct a situation that WOULD have it be exactly equal (it's theoretically possible, but would require being and maintaining a temperature of absolute zero...which is where no reacitons are allowed to occur anyway...) would also indicate there is no conservation at play.
...but then we can have some systems set up where we force part of the system to increase in entropy...and we see another part of the system decrease. It doesn't decrease by as much as the increase - because there still has to be a positive net increase overall - but it does increase, with no clear mechanism or cause as to why it should.
Unless...you were commenting more about the it being weird part? XD In which case, yes, I believe THAT part goes without saying...
lol, no, I was just trying to be funny, since it's a concept that many non-physicists (like me) would probably find somewhat boggling. Although I did basically follow your idea, and it's a cool way to think of it. But yeah, just a bit of layman's humor. :)
Counterfleche said: @Renathras, I appreciate your pointing out and citing examples where the Lore states that the gods (at least some) did exist. I had forgotten about some of it and wasn't aware of the rest. But I really appreciate your interesting meander to Entropy and Heat Death. I find the idea of a bunch of gods all moving to one planet as Heat Death refugees most interesting. The analogy I think of to explain how lthere can be localized pockets of reduced Entropy is air conditioning. You can air condition a building, making it cooler inside, but it makes it slightly hotter outside and the overall temperature of the area doesn't go down.