Forums » The Dire Lord

skills/spells community opinion

    • 70 posts
    March 11, 2019 7:18 PM PDT

    So i was just thinking about DL abilities. and was curious about the DL communities take on what we know thus far..  I know the DL *** is the not the same as any other class and isnt based on any other class in other games but lets face it, it appears as an sk DK etc. these questions i have in no way say the class doesnt already have them or will not at some point. we all know how far along the game is and how subject it could be to change so with that said my question is what do you think about the skills and spells we do have that we are currently aware of or wish we had? i'll start with a few basic...

    Fear - some of my best memories (while sk's were considered crappy tanks) was when i would fear kite along druids and necro's, really gave us options outside the normal tank n spank routine. also let us have options for duo's with druids enchanters and pretty much any class. for me this was a huge part of my experience... its been noted that we have a snare (that turns into a root later) already. while i dont think it should be as good as a necro's a fear kite system would sure bring another level of uniqueness to the class.

    block - being as we do not use shields, but are classified as a tank and been told we are just as much a tank as the rest should we be able to "block" with a 2her or DW? I know we gotta wait and see how it plays out but just number wise i think we should. or at least a hefty bonus to dodge since we are in lighter armor..

    Riposte - Same as above.

    Pets - while i was never really a fan of pets (skele) I did find its usefulness expecially in PVP/duels it was always more of a fluff spell to me. pulling with it was almost always a disaster (eq1/2)

    summon corpse - while I do beleive necro's should hold a monopoly on this, it would be nice maybe at 40+ to be able to attain this ability maybe through a much rougher quest or something... give the necro's a break from the /t spam 

    aoe - I was really hoping the DL would have a good amount of aoe's, seems as though the paladin is going to be the aoe class from what "my opinion is"

    stuns - while paladin apparently has most of the stuns and aoe's I think it would be nice if the DL would have some silences maybe? still not as good as stun but better than nothing... still think DL's should have a greater number of aoe's though and perhaps this is where fear could come into play :D

    FD - really think this would be nice. not a decision breaker but i loved being able to split in raids/groups when the monk was unavailable and the necro just couldnt take the first hit or two...

    Using a shield - This really really really kills me. its not the bonuses it provides its more my playstyle.  more of a visual thing to me than actual effect..

    armor - this goes allot with the above comment of shields... for me a huge bonus to playing a tank is the way i look as a tank, the awsome armor and shield it just really brings the class. alive.. so i guess here what im asking is as a community would we want to ask for appearance armor or just hope they make "mail" look baddass. while ive seen some that look good. aside from the "scale mail" dragonish type armor it all seems kinda meh...

    Life taps - I really think the life tap abilities are spot on (as much as i can tell from the streams i have seen)

    Taunts -  little concerned that at 30 ive only seen one taunt. but as stated its Pre alpha really hope they have options other than a static taunt into your 30's especially with ae/AoE taunts

    Im sure i left stuff out but what do you guys think about what we have (that we know of) what skills abilities really shine for your playstyle and make you proud to log in and say yep. im a badass

     

    • 274 posts
    March 12, 2019 7:43 AM PDT

    I think this class is just a twist for people who want to feel different as a tank. While I like the stylized sword and board, It might make someone more interested in playing as a tank if they dont have to use sword and board. Which is good to balance out the game.

    As for abilities, I really like the idea of them getting a corpse summon at a later level. I see no harm there. Pets could be more related to say ghosts, ghouls, phantoms. Now for armor, I like to feel big as a tank aswell, I saw the great look of Chain and am happy with its look on Ogre's who are naturlaly big, but what if it was on a Dark Myr? I would hope they could combine some plate with some mail for mail wearers. Like plate pauldrons with mail sleeves and plate gauntlets or some kind of mixture of those just to add the flavor of feeling like your character can handle a beating. Otherwise im completely satified with the abilites and playstyle that is DL.

    • 933 posts
    March 12, 2019 9:41 AM PDT

    Before this thread gets too out of control, I would like to interject that the DL is not supposed to be anything like the SHD (so likely no Fear, Pets, FD, corpse summoning, or anything that a necro may be using).  They are getting away from "Hybrid" classes with the exception of the Paladin in its literal translation, but even the Paladin uses different resources and has different abilities.  Like Valorousl mentioned, the DL is just a different flavor of tank.

    I think the abilities are really cool thus far though. 

    • 79 posts
    March 12, 2019 1:49 PM PDT

    I personally love the way a DL is. It kind of feels like a berserker but not barbaric, so the mail armor makes sense. Even in most pen and paper barbarians didn't wear heavy armor but had higher hps and tanked. I'm sure once we get testing that we will have some sort of block/parry/riposte that we have seen yet. I try not to look at them as a SK wielding magic, so pets and summons corpse don't work for me. I could see fear in the form of intimidation. I like DW so shields aren't a concern for me. We do have a passive taunt in one of our stances (Nightmare Blood) and our Provoking Phantoms to build hate. Would be nice for a snap taunt, even on a longer cooldown if needed. The rest of the kit looks good to me, I just wish I could be testing everything myself.

    • 1825 posts
    March 12, 2019 2:28 PM PDT

    Sure I miss Shadow Knight, Dark knight and variation concepts. I allways loved the fantasy of a heavily armored moralless knight slashing or crushing ennemies with dark powers.

     

    But I'm ready to embrace something different. I simply hope the exhaustive spell list will give us more "tools of the trade", Sk's utility was really great from fear, snares to FD and levitation. I just hope to get a bit of that, or similar tools, useable to adapt and change strategy.

    I'm fine with no FD even if it was a lifesaver and a big plus, a tank with FD is a danger for his team in bad hands.

    • 70 posts
    March 12, 2019 4:31 PM PDT

    @ Darch Sorry if my post mislead anyone into thinking im saying a DL is an SK clone. that wasnt my intent, what I was saying (as well as a fairly large part of the community) is its SK ish, no its not that same obviously, there are many many differences.  What i was trying to say is while there are differences and it will undoubtably play differently there are allot of similarities. between the two. life taps,dots, evil tank which is great. it gives all of us who played an sk a home with a character that we can relate to even if its not the same. and as far as this whole thread goes i was just bored and trying to breathe life into the DL forums... seems like a ghost town here. I was just trying to get peoples idea's of what the class may have (as stated all skills and spells arent even revealed on the streams).  or kind of a wishlist. thoughts about what could be improved on. this isnt a bashing thread by any means. if any took it that way sorry.

    • 70 posts
    March 12, 2019 4:55 PM PDT

    Draxsis said:

    I personally love the way a DL is. It kind of feels like a berserker but not barbaric, so the mail armor makes sense. Even in most pen and paper barbarians didn't wear heavy armor but had higher hps and tanked. I'm sure once we get testing that we will have some sort of block/parry/riposte that we have seen yet. I try not to look at them as a SK wielding magic, so pets and summons corpse don't work for me. I could see fear in the form of intimidation. I like DW so shields aren't a concern for me. We do have a passive taunt in one of our stances (Nightmare Blood) and our Provoking Phantoms to build hate. Would be nice for a snap taunt, even on a longer cooldown if needed. The rest of the kit looks good to me, I just wish I could be testing everything myself.

    I really do like the way the DL is as well draxsis, I was just trying to think about CR's and eq where my wife played a necro and was constantly getting tells for help and being as necro may or may not be available at launch either way i think it would be nice to have a second option to ask for help in a pinch, and with the DL's blood magic IMO it would be the closest class i can think of to have that skill set.  as for the taunt i was more on the line of what you were saying with a snap taunt. or even a weaker single target taunt and here was my line of thinking on that:  Lets say I accidently pulled 2 or 3 mobs. while I do have an enchanter my only taunt (minus the stance which is still single target) it would be nice to have the ability to throw that taunt on an add so the enchanter has a chance to mez it without getting hit or possibly killed before even getting one mez off.  I know you could just nuke it or quick tab and hit it for a tad of aggro but with heals going off etc that one add or 2 would be pingponging throughout the group.  i know there are a ton of scenario's that could play out.. FD pull/splitting, aggro reduction (proximity) etc etc but just as a "it would be nice" and im sure, like 95% confident that they arent going to leave the DL with one taunt. this is all just speculation from what ive seen and trying to get a chat started which apparently I failed at.  like they have stated we havnt seen half of whats out there.  

     

    I Definatly agree valorous1, this class is definatly for the "outside the box" people who want to tank, I have never really been a big fan of pets for tank classes but as i was reading your post when you said phantoms ghosts etc.  I thought of a spell effect i think would be pretty awsome (in my opinion) say you cast whatever spell its spell effect shows you ripping the soul/essense of the person out and it fights the target (maybe a ghastly mirror imagine) i think that would be pretty neat to see :) doesnt even have to be a huge spell but i think it would be a nice graphic


    This post was edited by Rhelic at March 12, 2019 5:13 PM PDT
    • 70 posts
    March 12, 2019 5:23 PM PDT

    Valorous1 said:

    I think this class is just a twist for people who want to feel different as a tank. While I like the stylized sword and board, It might make someone more interested in playing as a tank if they dont have to use sword and board. Which is good to balance out the game.

    As for abilities, I really like the idea of them getting a corpse summon at a later level. I see no harm there. Pets could be more related to say ghosts, ghouls, phantoms. Now for armor, I like to feel big as a tank aswell, I saw the great look of Chain and am happy with its look on Ogre's who are naturlaly big, but what if it was on a Dark Myr? I would hope they could combine some plate with some mail for mail wearers. Like plate pauldrons with mail sleeves and plate gauntlets or some kind of mixture of those just to add the flavor of feeling like your character can handle a beating. Otherwise im completely satified with the abilites and playstyle that is DL.

    well poo, not sure if we can upload pics but i tried and didnt work. so here a link: https://goo.gl/images/P7GYim this armor IMO looks so friggin awsome. ive always wanted a set but was never able to find anything that came close to it. but i think if they made mail for the DL to wear that looks like this i would wear it regardless of how crappy it was.. for me this looks really really awsome.  I do plan on making a dark myr DL and i think they would look SWEET in this armor.. 


    This post was edited by Rhelic at March 12, 2019 5:28 PM PDT
    • 79 posts
    March 12, 2019 5:29 PM PDT

    @Rhelic By no means was I trying to come off as arguing with you nor did I think you were looking for a full SK clone. I was just trying to give my point of view on how I see the class. Like how you see it as blood magic but I see it more like the description as Essence-manipulation but not in a magical way. I just don't feel like VR was intending the DL to have "magic" in the sense of pets/CSing or casting of spells but more as a slice the snot out of the mob melee. I think we all have some interesting ideas from what I have read on the forums so far. There are some I like and some I feel are meh but again that's just my opinion. My hope is that with some testing we may see a new point of view and can help shape the DL into a class we all enjoy.

    • 70 posts
    March 12, 2019 5:35 PM PDT

    No worries draxsis, that was more meant for darch's "before this gets outa hand" just wanted to let anyone reading this post  i wasnt trying to call this class an SK :) no hard feeling all around.  we have a great community and i see how my wording my have been misinterpreted so i do appreciate darch's catch, which led me to clarify what i was actually trying to say. i hope i explained it better the second time :P 

    • 274 posts
    March 13, 2019 7:04 AM PDT

    well poo, not sure if we can upload pics but i tried and didnt work. so here a link: https://goo.gl/images/P7GYim this armor IMO looks so friggin awsome. ive always wanted a set but was never able to find anything that came close to it. but i think if they made mail for the DL to wear that looks like this i would wear it regardless of how crappy it was.. for me this looks really really awsome.  I do plan on making a dark myr DL and i think they would look SWEET in this armor.. 

    Yeah I agree that looks pretty good.

     

    • 222 posts
    March 21, 2019 10:17 AM PDT

    Valorous1 said:

    As for abilities, I really like the idea of them getting a corpse summon at a later level. I see no harm there. Pets could be more related to say ghosts, ghouls, phantoms. Now for armor, I like to feel big as a tank aswell, I saw the great look of Chain and am happy with its look on Ogre's who are naturlaly big, but what if it was on a Dark Myr? I would hope they could combine some plate with some mail for mail wearers. 

    It might make sense to give the Dark Myr scalemail, as they're aquatic. Same stats and such as chain, just a different racial look.

    From the ogre lore:

    When cast upon the naked land of Terminus, the frail bounds between the clans ruptured in haste. After eons of forced restraint, total war arrived. This scale of this conflict would have consumed the race, had not a dark messiah risen from the chaos. Rothuk, Clan Lord of the Black Moon tribe, took his tribe to a mountain ridge far to the south, claiming it called his name. Into this haunt he trekked alone, with the Tome of the Black Moon, whispering that the secrets of the runes could be opened therein. Missing for weeks, as the red Ogres of Dark Sun assaulted the last of his men, Rothuk emerged from the mists and shadows, forever changed.

    "Clouds of dust filled the air. Down the great bowl of the haunted lands the Dark Sun ran, numbers very great. We would bring them into our death.

    Then I heard Rothuk's bellow, like a mountain when it breathes fire. The warriors of Dark Sun stopped and looked to the skies. But he was already in front of them. I still cannot say what I saw, but the wall of the bowl was covered in their blood. Their corpses are still frozen in the crust of the earth. None survived."

    - Krogad, Black Moon Lieutenant           

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        It would seem that the origins of the dire lord are here, in whatever was in the tome Rothuk unlocked. I'm not so sure it's necromantic, in the purest sense of the word. This seems to be a (one of seven, perhaps?) skill given to the ogres by the Graven Hold to aid them. Given the fact that the ogres are constantly fighting and combat-oriented, it makes sense that manipulating the blood generated could and would be used to their benefit or their foes detriment.                            Edit: Apologies for the broken text, not sure why the format is so off.                                                                                                                                                                                              


    This post was edited by Percipiens at March 21, 2019 10:18 AM PDT
    • 27 posts
    June 3, 2019 9:17 AM PDT

    Draxsis said:

    I personally love the way a DL is. It kind of feels like a berserker but not barbaric, so the mail armor makes sense. 

     

    This

     

    I like that feel, Looking forward to playing this class. 

    • 2740 posts
    June 3, 2019 10:25 AM PDT

    Percipiens said:                                                                                                                                                                                                                                It would seem that the origins of the dire lord are here, in whatever was in the tome Rothuk unlocked. I'm not so sure it's necromantic, in the purest sense of the word. This seems to be a (one of seven, perhaps?) skill given to the ogres by the Graven Hold to aid them. Given the fact that the ogres are constantly fighting and combat-oriented, it makes sense that manipulating the blood generated could and would be used to their benefit or their foes detriment.                            Edit: Apologies for the broken text, not sure why the format is so off.                                                                                                                                                                                              

    That isn't the origin of the Dire Lord...at least I don't see how it is related at all.


    This post was edited by Iksar at June 3, 2019 10:26 AM PDT
    • 933 posts
    April 26, 2020 9:22 AM PDT

    Arlore said:

    Draxsis said:

    I personally love the way a DL is. It kind of feels like a berserker but not barbaric, so the mail armor makes sense. 

    This

    I like that feel, Looking forward to playing this class. 

    This is exactly how they should've presented the DL to squash all of the comparison to the SHD of EQ.  It should've been called Bloodzerker or something.  It is more like EQ's Berserker class than the SHD.  It's just a shame that they didn't at least pay homage to one of the most iconic EQ classes in a game that is being made in the spirit of EQ... yet.  The Enchanter, Shaman and SHD were kinda original to EQ since all of the other vanilla classes were designed around Dungeons & Dragons... yet they have the Shaman and Enchanter in PRotF (and didn't even give any other class a clever name change).  

    I'm thinking there may be a shadow knight with an expansion (possibly why they were contemplating not having the necro at release at first too).  That would certainly influence a lot of players that were on the fence about the game to play, or come back if they had left.  Playing a tank that intentionally gets beat in the face harder than everyone else in order to bleed more isn't appealing to my RP style personally.  I'll wait for the SHD.

    • 37 posts
    May 16, 2020 4:30 AM PDT

    Yea I'll give the game a look and tinker with a couple classes, but thats about it. I'm throwing all my attention into New World when it comes out in August now that Chronicles of Elyria has gone belly up. It's a shame about DL's, was really hoping for a new game with something close to an SK. But hey, its like they say, maybe in an expac or something they'll bring'em out. Then i might give it a bit of time.

    • 6 posts
    August 3, 2020 9:17 PM PDT
    Canopy of Blood will make DL's almost mandatory for PvP groups and probably very useful for some raid encounters. I can see it being great for engaging and also to use as a escape. Its nice to see this Utility thrown into their kit
     
    Canopy of Blood

     You release nearly all of the blood in your veins, sacrificing 25% of your health to create a covering that renders all within X meters of you immune to magical effects for a short time. (Uses Essence)


    This post was edited by NickBuck at August 3, 2020 9:20 PM PDT
    • 57 posts
    August 28, 2020 12:20 AM PDT

    So just pledged and created an account i will be maining the direlord. My thoughts on this topic is,  and i should admit i played a shadowknight main in everquest at a high lvl of the game skill and raid content wise so take that into consideration when assessing my opinion as i may be biased but i am truly trying to assess this with balance in mind.

     

    I think the direlord will be a different take on the tank that overall i feel is a very exciting take and only time will tell if it turns into the "crap tank" or something valid either way i will still main becouse if he turns out great per meta great if not then i will attempt to play him well enough to buck the meta and possibly make people rethink the meta but there is one thing i would like to discuss

    The current warrior is exactally what id expect so nothing to really say here no changes needed as per balance. The paladians now is where i have issue when compairing them to direlords. Now first off lets play a thought experment. Name me one game where the paladians were underpowered compaired to other tanks in the game? I cant think of one so across the industry this just seems to be normal. One could day there is a paladian or holy knight bias lol but either way lets just get out of the way that this isnt a visonary realms balance issue its a game creators handbook issue lol ( sorry couldnt find a better phrase for that )

     

    So lets do a compairson 

    The direlord is a chain wearing tank but the balance to this is he can regen hps faster. The faster regen stat will be based on your total hp pool as they said in a press release so the direlord will be a hp tank as opposed to an ac tank. Since they are a caster based tank with there high magic defense this makes sense since i will assume casters monsters have cast times associated with there spells so nuke give time for dire to regen nuke and to ad to this there ability to raise magic defense using abilities. Alot of there abilties seem flavorful but very situational i mean just go over the list there are only a few abilities that would be good in most situations but i feel that could add to the fun of playing the class effectivly. But let it be said that this does make direlords as it stands now inferior to warrior and paladians and lets pretend that paladian can take hits = to warrior in a raw mitigation stance. Well that would be a mistake and also cement pallys to be the hands down best tank in any situation. And yes even against a all caster camp in group content and ill explain why when we get to the paladins overview below

    The paladin is a plate tank without the regen capibilities of the direlord so meele hits will do less but he wont regen the hps naturally. Beyond that i should point this out.. The paladin has undead killing abilities now imho while very situational generally is quite a bit over powered also considering they have a ability that heals members of a group based on a % of damage passivly. Now even tho i said that im not calling for a undoing of there slay undead abilities since if they did that it wouldnt be a pally, but this needs to be pointed out when talking about balance. A pally can heal single target without switching targets off attacking mob ( per defensive target ) group heal in various fourms, rezz ( got a shaman as main healer??? Its cool that he doesnt have a good rezz ability pally can rezz and spot heal ), pallys can stun, strip buffs off a mob, AOE TAUNT, taunt in more ways then is currently available for direlords weither single or aoe ( no aoe taunt for DL which is a big bugg in my butt) 

    Simply put the devs said they wanted all tanks to be viable all healers to be viable. Personally i think this is a valiant cause to persue but there will always be a meta and if i was a betting man Direlord in its current state is a hard sell to anyone but the foolish like myself for reasons i said above or for people who dont care about the strenght of there charcter but more the flavor of the charcter lore wise. Which i can respect but wont get you into groups easier

     

    So is the DL a lost cause just forget it ever existed and roll a pally or warrior for tank??? Well not yet here is what i thibk the minium should be thought about and beyond that i encurage the devs to look here for other ideas to put into the future or current gameplan for direlords im sure as a community we can come up with inovation that fits in with the lore of the charcter

    The one thing i would make sure of is that the dire lord is the master above all other classes at generating hate. Abilities below should do the same thing but have hate applied to them to seperate the DL as the superior hate tank

     

    Harm shield- Bring your blood to the surface of your skin and infuse it with caustic properties. Any physical damage dealt to you within a 6m radius will cause blood to splash on the attacking enemy, dealing damage. And increases hate toward you

    Dire Mark- You mark a member of your group. Whenever that group member takes damage, X% of that damage will be redirected to you. And increases hate toward you

    Blood fiend - If you are afflicted with a poison or disease, this ability will afflict the same poison or disease onto your enemy. (Uses Essence) and greatly increases hate toward you ( ability increses hate reguardless of if you have poisen or disease or not )

    Abyssal Strike - A vicious attack that ignores all enemy armor. (Uses Essence) and greatly increases hate toward you

    Splatter - A violent attack that splatters your enemy’s essence in a small radius. Other enemies within that radius have a chance to be afflicted with the same detrimental effects as your target. (Uses Essence) And increases hate toward you

     

    This is what i personally would change with the DL but we are a community so what is your take on this?

     

    The DL is a chain based tank so this would mean if we were the aggro based tank id love this class to be we would have to use it wisely as our mitigation wouldnt be on par with the other 2 tanks but that is where the balance is. We in turn would have a bigger skill set for raids would be disarable in dps heavy groups where you can rely on a skilled DL to hold aggro even against a wiz going crazy with fire nukes ( i did say skilled DL ) and we would be able to stand out as a tank needed but for different reasons in a more fair and balanced way

     

     

    If your still reading i thank you for your patience in this long post and hopefully this will hit a dev meeting if us as a community feel this would be a good direction for the DL

     

    • 138 posts
    September 2, 2020 5:23 PM PDT

    Dire Mark seems to relegate Dire Lord to secondary Raid Tank. Hope more thought goes into that one.

    • 758 posts
    September 2, 2020 6:04 PM PDT

    Filzin said:

    Dire Mark seems to relegate Dire Lord to secondary Raid Tank. Hope more thought goes into that one.

    I agree that Dire Mark will be very helpful when playing DL as a secondary tank. However I see Dire Mark as helpful in every group I play my DL in. It will always be beneficial to have it on my healer in a challenging fight. And anytime I have a particularly vulnerable group member, maybe a guildie who is a level or two lower than the rest of us, particulary if he's a 'squishee' class. So I don't perceive it as relegating DL to anything.